The Disappearance of Midlist Bands or My Chemical Romance has 54 Million Views

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Finding great new music is always a good thing. It seems like it should happen all the time in this glorious digital age we are living in. I mean, artists can go straight to fans without the intervention of stodgy labels and, because everybody can post their opinion online, the fans can be the ones to say whether they like something or not. That is the utopian ideal there anyway.

When people actually go looking for music today, I think it is actually...

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Originally Posted by The Newswire

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I've had some good luck with scrobbling (http://www.last.fm) I'm a total audiophile though. Usually, I'll already have about 90% of "my recommendations". The recommendations are not corporate driven. I have found local bands in towns ranging from Boston to Milwaukee to Helsinki. My scrobbler is fucked right now due to my attempt to reset it to my nephew's birthday, but I'll post it again at some point. You could thus get an idea of its strengths and limitations.

OEC

First of all "Hey there!" - i'm not good in introductions.

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Originally Posted by One Eyed Cat

The recommendations are not corporate driven.

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No, but did You ever notice what rivetheads like me call the "string paradox"? Their clustering algorythm ("other people who like this also like..") makes it so that the one day you play a song involving any number of guitars, COLDPLAY won't vanish from your recommendations list anymore -.-


@Amelia
side-line[dot]com do a pretty awesome job at keeping people updated about the industrial spectrum of things. (Seems i need to write some stuff first to post real urls, sorry)

I think there are quite some websites who replace print magazines, it just depends on one's standard: there are few ajaxified web2.0 multimedia sites yes, but how do they compare to print magazines, anyway? If you do away with the RSS, friend lists and flash videos there happen to be sites with a lot more information on bands as fits on a youtube video description

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Originally Posted by maestro

First of all "Hey there!" - i'm not good in introductions.



No, but did You ever notice what rivetheads like me call the "string paradox"? Their clustering algorythm ("other people who like this also like..") makes it so that the one day you play a song involving any number of guitars, COLDPLAY won't vanish from your recommendations list anymore -.-


@Amelia
side-line[dot]com do a pretty awesome job at keeping people updated about the industrial spectrum of things. (Seems i need to write some stuff first to post real urls, sorry)

I think there are quite some websites who replace print magazines, it just depends on one's standard: there are few ajaxified web2.0 multimedia sites yes, but how do they compare to print magazines, anyway? If you do away with the RSS, friend lists and flash videos there happen to be sites with a lot more information on bands as fits on a youtube video description

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Hasn't happened to me. My listening patterns would tend to negate rivet-based loops though too. I have no doubt a number of such schemes are in play there. I delete any recommendations that are irrelevant to my tastes.

i miss audiogalaxies.

sure they got into a lot of legal woes which caused their demise but what i enjoyed most about the site were to communities and the recommendations that came up. i also met a few good people of the communities.

there just seems to be nothing of the sort nowadays.

I've used ******* for music promotion as it was the first website i heard non computer literate people discus that they updated regularly, and i liked its search tools to list bands of a certain genre in your area, but how many of my full time job colleagues knew about this.... none.

most search for stuff they know.

i also remember a conversation with a guitarist explaining how he got into new music was by the vinyl stickers on the instatements of his favoured band, and would go and check them out at his local music shop (before the internet really steam rolled its way into non geek culture) which stocked everything and anything. the shop in question went under as HMV and Virgin megastores moved into town, a crying shame in my opinion, HMV and Virgin are just simply taking the mickey with their prices and the fact they NEVER have anything I'm looking for in stock

I really miss the old MP3.com site. They had a really cool setup. Currently I'm a big fan of Live365 and since I have a subscription I can even listen to my station presets on my Tivo, which is kinda cool. They allow you to sort of add songs you like to your purchase wishlist right while you are listening to them as well as give the dj immediate thumbs up and thumbs down feedback on their track selection. The only drawback is that people don't mix up their playlist that often so I do find myself wearing through certain stations.

MP3.com is where I and my friends began our careers as dj's oddly. I remember back in the day when being listed on mp3.com was the cool.

hi amelia,

i enjoyed reading that. however, i have to correct you on something: since i started nasty little man PR out of my bedroom in 1992, we have never worked with marilyn manson. in fact, i only signed on with NIN earlier this year upon trent's emancipation from interscope.

the manson cassette was either sent to you by the label or by formula PR who repped manson at the time.

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Originally Posted by Smartin

hi amelia,

i enjoyed reading that. however, i have to correct you on something: since i started nasty little man PR out of my bedroom in 1992, we have never worked with marilyn manson. in fact, i only signed on with NIN earlier this year upon trent's emancipation from interscope.

the manson cassette was either sent to you by the label or by formula PR who repped manson at the time.

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I am so going to be sitting up at night trying to figure this one out. I didn't know Nasty Little Man was still around, but I just looked at the band list on your site, for at least some of who you were repping around that time. I think I interviewed Sick Of It All earlier than that. We did a small thing on Rancid I think, but that would have just been off a record label press kit and would have been later. Forrest Black worked on a bunch of the marketing materials for the Beastie Boys during the time you worked with them, but publicity wouldn't have been a factor on that and I assume wouldn't have come up.

I'm pretty sure Nasty Little Man was on the comp list for Blue Blood in print and I'm pretty sure I've held press releases from Nasty Little Man on paper in my hands. Should I assume that "select campaigns" means there are more which are not listed on there?

Is it possible that I had Nasty Little Man and Formula both on my call list on the same day and accidentally called NLM to get something on an unrepped band? It's possible that I was calling both and got confused and I surely remember being shocked that a fairly new band so entirely in Blue Blood's demographic would be bitchy about something as little as a CD while paying for professional PR. I was even more puzzled later when I heard they were really worked up about not getting coverage in Blue Blood. I can't think who you were working with then who I would have been calling about though. Any ideas? Phones are so primitive; thanks goodness I never use them any more. Much easier to keep everything like that all straight with email.

I'm a lil mortified. Thanks for stopping by and setting the record straight :thumb:

no reason at all to be even a little mortified. happens almost daily. back then though, the music business was way more of an insane mess of labels, PR firms, you name it. i rather enjoy it being increasingly streamlined.

I do remember getting Blue Blood in print--and by the way congrats on surviving and changing with the changing times. and you are correct re: "select campaigns." Didn't we do something with Rammstein? like around 1998-1999 when they were really working and peaking in the U.S.?

I honestly never worked with Manson but your story doesn't surprise me. Don't forget that around that same time he paid a settlement for roughing up (with help from his security) the then-editor of Spin for not getting a cover or being in their year-end best of or something.

anyway i do encounter a lot of confusion with people assuming that because i work with NIN i work with former Nothing Records artists or because I work with Radiohead i automatically work Jonny Greenwood's There Will Be Blood soundtrack or because I work with Damon Albarn i must work on his Mali and Honest Jon's stuff... I could go on forever but i fear I'm already boring you.

Oh and as for the theme of this piece? I risk showing my age, but here's an idea for your readers: turn off the computer and get out of the house. see live music. if you're interested in discovering similar music to your favorite artists, use the internet to check out their favorites and inspirations, then go see those artists. it takes legwork to find decent new small to mid-size undiscovered artists.

like it or not, the the most trafficked sites on the internet are mainstream media and mainstream media are always and inevitably co-opted and homogenized by those with the deepest pockets.

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Originally Posted by Smartin

no reason at all to be even a little mortified. happens almost daily. back then though, the music business was way more of an insane mess of labels, PR firms, you name it. i rather enjoy it being increasingly streamlined.

I do remember getting Blue Blood in print--and by the way congrats on surviving and changing with the changing times. and you are correct re: "select campaigns." Didn't we do something with Rammstein? like around 1998-1999 when they were really working and peaking in the U.S.?

I honestly never worked with Manson but your story doesn't surprise me. Don't forget that around that same time he paid a settlement for roughing up (with help from his security) the then-editor of Spin for not getting a cover or being in their year-end best of or something.

anyway i do encounter a lot of confusion with people assuming that because i work with NIN i work with former Nothing Records artists or because I work with Radiohead i automatically work Jonny Greenwood's There Will Be Blood soundtrack or because I work with Damon Albarn i must work on his Mali and Honest Jon's stuff... I could go on forever but i fear I'm already boring you.

Oh and as for the theme of this piece? I risk showing my age, but here's an idea for your readers: turn off the computer and get out of the house. see live music. if you're interested in discovering similar music to your favorite artists, use the internet to check out their favorites and inspirations, then go see those artists. it takes legwork to find decent new small to mid-size undiscovered artists.

like it or not, the the most trafficked sites on the internet are mainstream media and mainstream media are always and inevitably co-opted and homogenized by those with the deepest pockets.

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Why not do both? I generally go to about one live show a week. Good way to find local bands in genres I enjoy. I've also found a lot of great bands on the internet. You need not pay heed to any self-anointed "musical journalist". It really isn't that hard to find non-corporate bands with a few tunes you can listen to. I see no shortage of niche bands. You just have to put some effort into finding them.

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Originally Posted by One Eyed Cat

Why not do both? I generally go to about one live show a week. Good way to find local bands in genres I enjoy. I've also found a lot of great bands on the internet. You need not pay heed to any self-anointed "musical journalist". It really isn't that hard to find non-corporate bands with a few tunes you can listen to. I see no shortage of niche bands. You just have to put some effort into finding them.

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i agree. as i understood amelia's piece, she was discouraged that niche bands were hard to find on youtube. while i understand her frustration, the reality is youtube in 2008 is NBC in 1978. you can scour for hours, days, months, years before you stumble across The Clash on SNL. you have to hit the street and alternative outlets. "musical journalists"--i assume you mean mainstream print--are there to report on things that are already happening, not what's yet to be discovered.

main issue i have with finding stuff on the internet is that, now more than ever, you might be hearing the sizzle and not the steak, if you know what i mean. those tracks could be overproduced and protooled and autotuned to high heaven. just speaking for myself personally, i gotta see the goods live.

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Originally Posted by Smartin

i agree. as i understood amelia's piece, she was discouraged that niche bands were hard to find on youtube. while i understand her frustration, the reality is youtube in 2008 is NBC in 1978. you can scour for hours, days, months, years before you stumble across The Clash on SNL. you have to hit the street and alternative outlets. "musical journalists"--i assume you mean mainstream print--are there to report on things that are already happening, not what's yet to be discovered.

main issue i have with finding stuff on the internet is that, now more than ever, you might be hearing the sizzle and not the steak, if you know what i mean. those tracks could be overproduced and protooled and autotuned to high heaven. just speaking for myself personally, i gotta see the goods live.

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Yeah, youtube won't get you there. The one use I have found for youtube: Concert footage of shows I was at or had wanted to see. The music I find strictly on the internet is usually in odd genres like cabaret noir/ dark circus madness etc.

Dead Brothers

Beat Circus

It is possible they would not be the same live. I download via itunes if I like what I hear, but obviously you would be right in a lot of instances.

"Musicial Journalists" - Some have valid criticisms. I just find them useless as I can hear most of it for myself.

Here's where this gets interesting: I took one of your calls, and I'm pretty sure it was about Manson at Formula way back when. (Yes, "Scott from Formula", or one of them anyway, was briefly me. It's actually the only time you and I have talked on the phone. Small world, eh?) I don't think I handled the whole call (I think I passed you to Sioux Z. or whoever her assistant was at that point), and it is possible that we just had advance cassettes at the time, in which case, inconvenience or not, you could've just given us a call back when we got the CDs. I had to do that all the time when I was with Propaganda (it's annoying when you're super busy, admittedly), and while a publicist or two got pissy with me, more often than not, they'd send the CD, as everyone was pretty free and easy about sending product that artists were paying for to journalists back then. Formula was no exception there. More than likely, the followup just got lost in the shuffle, as there was a fair amount of turnover in the office at that point, and we were dealing with a lot of campaigns that year (several NIN ones including the Bowie tour, Manson, Ruby, Prick, a few different Jungle compilations, etc.) with a very small, underequipped staff.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

I am so going to be sitting up at night trying to figure this one out. I didn't know Nasty Little Man was still around, but I just looked at the band list on your site, for at least some of who you were repping around that time. I think I interviewed Sick Of It All earlier than that. We did a small thing on Rancid I think, but that would have just been off a record label press kit and would have been later. Forrest Black worked on a bunch of the marketing materials for the Beastie Boys during the time you worked with them, but publicity wouldn't have been a factor on that and I assume wouldn't have come up.

I'm pretty sure Nasty Little Man was on the comp list for Blue Blood in print and I'm pretty sure I've held press releases from Nasty Little Man on paper in my hands. Should I assume that "select campaigns" means there are more which are not listed on there?

Is it possible that I had Nasty Little Man and Formula both on my call list on the same day and accidentally called NLM to get something on an unrepped band? It's possible that I was calling both and got confused and I surely remember being shocked that a fairly new band so entirely in Blue Blood's demographic would be bitchy about something as little as a CD while paying for professional PR. I was even more puzzled later when I heard they were really worked up about not getting coverage in Blue Blood. I can't think who you were working with then who I would have been calling about though. Any ideas? Phones are so primitive; thanks goodness I never use them any more. Much easier to keep everything like that all straight with email.

I'm a lil mortified. Thanks for stopping by and setting the record straight :thumb:

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Originally Posted by mybigblackcockdotcom

Here's where this gets interesting: I took one of your calls, and I'm pretty sure it was about Manson at Formula way back when. (Yes, "Scott from Formula", or one of them anyway, was briefly me. It's actually the only time you and I have talked on the phone. Small world, eh?) I don't think I handled the whole call (I think I passed you to Sioux Z. or whoever her assistant was at that point), and it is possible that we just had advance cassettes at the time, in which case, inconvenience or not, you could've just given us a call back when we got the CDs. I had to do that all the time when I was with Propaganda (it's annoying when you're super busy, admittedly), and while a publicist or two got pissy with me, more often than not, they'd send the CD, as everyone was pretty free and easy about sending product that artists were paying for to journalists back then. Formula was no exception there. More than likely, the followup just got lost in the shuffle, as there was a fair amount of turnover in the office at that point, and we were dealing with a lot of campaigns that year (several NIN ones including the Bowie tour, Manson, Ruby, Prick, a few different Jungle compilations, etc.) with a very small, underequipped staff.

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Well, hasn't this post turned into a bit of a David Lynch movie. :1orglaugh So whose responsibility was it when Blue Blood kept getting four tickets to sold out shows, instead of two tickets and two backstage passes? I'm almost scared to ask now.

(This gets long...)

Damned if I know who messed up your passes. To put it as politely and diplomatically as possible, the office got a bit...overwhelmed...at times back then, and I didn't have a lot of control over who got what tickets/passes. Here and there, I made a save or two, but usually, those decisions were made higher up on the food chain.

Plus, as we know so well, after a guest list leaves a publicist's office, it can be subject to all kinds of mayhem, everything from venue fuckups to road manager fuckups to label politics (especially when an artist goes with an indie publicist rather than staying in-house, as Steve would probably attest to off the record) and shenanigans of all other sorts. Faxes and FedEx packages with tickets get lost. Weird stuff happens. Clutch once took me off their guest list because they had a friend who was also named Scott Crawford who wasn't coming to the gig in question, and they assumed that I was him. (They later apologized for the mistake, and are good guys in general, in my experience.)

For those in the audience just getting started in music journalism: when you run up against this stuff, it's always good to be prepared (have the name of a tour manager or someone from the label who's going to be on-site if possible), patient (get there early and don't sweat if it takes a while to get in), firm and polite. Stand your ground, but do it without burning bridges or losing your temper, because people who work at and run venues tend to lean heavily toward not wanting to put up with bullshit (in fairness, they have to deal with a lot of it), assume that everyone who wants in for free is trying to scam them (likewise, plenty of folks do try to and succeed in bullshitting their way past the gate), and are known to have a "this is my house" attitude (this isn't universal by any means, and some venues are really well-run, but I've run into some real characters in my day, too).

To actually contribute something on-topic, I have noticed that *good* music coverage is especially hard to find for older mid-level bands (the newer ones get covered plenty by Pitchfork, Perez, Brooklynvegan and all those other sites I'd rather not look at, but because of those sites and others, names of newer bands do get out there...). I do my best to keep tabs on the bands I've liked over the years at the Cock (How else would Shriekback's last 2 albums, both brilliant, get any coverage?), but at the risk of pissing people off, for a lot of those acts, the best press they get comes from the fact that people post their albums for free on Usenet and torrent sites. If their record's good, the people who download it will make a point of trying to catch them when they tour, and being that we're talking about a lot of "record geek" bands, they'll also probably buy a hard copy of the CD. The acts in question typically don't "work" the 'net like they should or find people who can, nor can they afford shelf space in book stores or Starbucks (which is where a lot of their over-30 audiences hear new music at this point). Plus, there's that problematic assumption that once you're over 30, you don't want to hear any loud, aggressive music, which doesn't affect the top-level bands like NIN that much (though, if Trent weren't putting out so much pro-downloading, pro-fan stuff in the press, I think he'd have lost his audience years ago), but for a band like Skinny Puppy, for instance, it's marketing death (not that anyone in the business has ever really known how to market Puppy who, like The Cure, should have been Grateful Dead kinda big by now). The book store/coffee house types have this fixation with quiet, earthy music that's really insulting at times to their core audience, no matter how much I like that new Aimee Mann record. ;)

One thing Propaganda used to take some knocks for (among many things) is the fact that there really wasn't any negative music coverage in it, and I think those were, on some level, pretty unfair knocks. True to the magazine's name, everything written about a band in Propaganda made that band sound like THE GREATEST BAND EVER (You're welcome for the career, Sean), but it also made people want to go out and hear the music we were covering. I have taken some of that to heart, and generally, when I write about music online, I try to keep it positive, because exposing people to good music is way more important and productive than flexing your music nerd dick or ripping apart Metallica's records. No matter how much my readers wish I'd spend more time tearing artists to shreds, I'll always prefer saying "Hey, this is awesome!" about something they don't already know about.

In closing (finally), it's tough to keep up with everything that comes out, yeah, but I'm finding that the best way to find coverage of the types of artists you're looking for is to create that coverage yourself. So, get to work! ;)

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Originally Posted by mybigblackcockdotcom

(This gets long...)

Damned if I know who messed up your passes. To put it as politely and diplomatically as possible, the office got a bit...overwhelmed...at times back then, and I didn't have a lot of control over who got what tickets/passes. Here and there, I made a save or two, but usually, those decisions were made higher up on the food chain.

Plus, as we know so well, after a guest list leaves a publicist's office, it can be subject to all kinds of mayhem, everything from venue fuckups to road manager fuckups to label politics (especially when an artist goes with an indie publicist rather than staying in-house, as Steve would probably attest to off the record) and shenanigans of all other sorts. Faxes and FedEx packages with tickets get lost. Weird stuff happens. Clutch once took me off their guest list because they had a friend who was also named Scott Crawford who wasn't coming to the gig in question, and they assumed that I was him. (They later apologized for the mistake, and are good guys in general, in my experience.)

For those in the audience just getting started in music journalism: when you run up against this stuff, it's always good to be prepared (have the name of a tour manager or someone from the label who's going to be on-site if possible), patient (get there early and don't sweat if it takes a while to get in), firm and polite. Stand your ground, but do it without burning bridges or losing your temper, because people who work at and run venues tend to lean heavily toward not wanting to put up with bullshit (in fairness, they have to deal with a lot of it), assume that everyone who wants in for free is trying to scam them (likewise, plenty of folks do try to and succeed in bullshitting their way past the gate), and are known to have a "this is my house" attitude (this isn't universal by any means, and some venues are really well-run, but I've run into some real characters in my day, too).

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It would not have seemed so odd if I showed up and there were the right number of tickets and no backstage passes. It was just always, surprise, you have twice as many tickets as you needed or expected and no backstage passes. If the extra tickets were there on purpose, then it would have been helpful to know that we could hook up Blue Blood pals with free tickets to sold out shows. But it was always a bizarre surprise. Any recollection who the chick in the office was who tried to get me to convince Fiona Apple (this was how I first heard of her) to do Marilyn Manson on camera for a Blue Blood spread?

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Originally Posted by mybigblackcockdotcom

To actually contribute something on-topic, I have noticed that *good* music coverage is especially hard to find for older mid-level bands (the newer ones get covered plenty by Pitchfork, Perez, Brooklynvegan and all those other sites I'd rather not look at, but because of those sites and others, names of newer bands do get out there...). I do my best to keep tabs on the bands I've liked over the years at the Cock (How else would Shriekback's last 2 albums, both brilliant, get any coverage?), but at the risk of pissing people off, for a lot of those acts, the best press they get comes from the fact that people post their albums for free on Usenet and torrent sites. If their record's good, the people who download it will make a point of trying to catch them when they tour, and being that we're talking about a lot of "record geek" bands, they'll also probably buy a hard copy of the CD. The acts in question typically don't "work" the 'net like they should or find people who can, nor can they afford shelf space in book stores or Starbucks (which is where a lot of their over-30 audiences hear new music at this point). Plus, there's that problematic assumption that once you're over 30, you don't want to hear any loud, aggressive music, which doesn't affect the top-level bands like NIN that much (though, if Trent weren't putting out so much pro-downloading, pro-fan stuff in the press, I think he'd have lost his audience years ago), but for a band like Skinny Puppy, for instance, it's marketing death (not that anyone in the business has ever really known how to market Puppy who, like The Cure, should have been Grateful Dead kinda big by now). The book store/coffee house types have this fixation with quiet, earthy music that's really insulting at times to their core audience, no matter how much I like that new Aimee Mann record. ;)

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I sort of assumed Pitchfork was all paid placement coverage. Is that not accurate? Perez is exactly the kind of coverage I was talking about in the article where it is much easier to find which musicians got a DUI or dated somebody than any kind of an opinion on their work. I'm with you on not really getting the whole NWilliamsburg vibe.

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Originally Posted by mybigblackcockdotcom

One thing Propaganda used to take some knocks for (among many things) is the fact that there really wasn't any negative music coverage in it, and I think those were, on some level, pretty unfair knocks. True to the magazine's name, everything written about a band in Propaganda made that band sound like THE GREATEST BAND EVER (You're welcome for the career, Sean), but it also made people want to go out and hear the music we were covering. I have taken some of that to heart, and generally, when I write about music online, I try to keep it positive, because exposing people to good music is way more important and productive than flexing your music nerd dick or ripping apart Metallica's records. No matter how much my readers wish I'd spend more time tearing artists to shreds, I'll always prefer saying "Hey, this is awesome!" about something they don't already know about.

In closing (finally), it's tough to keep up with everything that comes out, yeah, but I'm finding that the best way to find coverage of the types of artists you're looking for is to create that coverage yourself. So, get to work! ;)

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I always had people wanting to contribute really eviscerating music reviews and book reviews to Blue Blood. I think internet coverage can afford to be a bit more mixed, but, if I was going to spend all that $$$$$$$$$$ to put ink on paper, I couldn't see wasting the space on being negative. I still think it only makes sense to do negative coverage on something if it is newsworthy. Like if some guy in his basement puts a sucky bunch of songs on his ******* profile, I do not think it is appropriate to write a review taking his music apart. If an important or otherwise well-known artist puts out a disappointing album, then that is news. Basically, I think something needs to be newsworthy and, when putting ink on paper, it seems like it makes the most sense to just not cover something which sucks.

Was Sean as much of an unappreciative little bitch to Propaganda as to everyone else who has ever shown him any kindness or support in his miserable life? For the record, although old skool folks probably know I had to sue Fred, I did like his magazine and his work, and I'm not about to look for the negative there either, just because he treated me badly.

Kind of funny really thinking about some of this stuff, which I haven't thought about in forever, some of which seemed so crucial at the time. Then again, ironic that some of it can always come back to haunt one at the oddest times.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

It would not have seemed so odd if I showed up and there were the right number of tickets and no backstage passes. It was just always, surprise, you have twice as many tickets as you needed or expected and no backstage passes. If the extra tickets were there on purpose, then it would have been helpful to know that we could hook up Blue Blood pals with free tickets to sold out shows. But it was always a bizarre surprise. Any recollection who the chick in the office was who tried to get me to convince Fiona Apple (this was how I first heard of her) to do Marilyn Manson on camera for a Blue Blood spread?

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That Fiona Apple thing was after my time, but it sounds suspiciously like something one of my exes, who worked there after I did (she met Sioux through me), and who shall remain nameless, might've tried to do. She was big into both Manson and Fiona. Thing is, by the time "Tidal" and "Lost Highway" both came out (Manson met Fiona at a VMAs ceremony, and in interviews, he's recalled his "Apple Of Sodom" playing in the background when he first saw her; don't ask me how or why I remember these things), I'm reasonably sure he was an ex-Formula client, so the timeline's a little fuzzy there. I'm just about positive he left when "Antichrist Superstar" came out, but I could be mistaken.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

I sort of assumed Pitchfork was all paid placement coverage. Is that not accurate? Perez is exactly the kind of coverage I was talking about in the article where it is much easier to find which musicians got a DUI or dated somebody than any kind of an opinion on their work. I'm with you on not really getting the whole NWilliamsburg vibe.

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No idea on Pitchfork, but I also don't care, either, because whether the reviews are good, bad, ugly or paid for, Pitchfork just ain't my cup of tea. Folks try way too hard there. As far as Williamsburg goes, I like a fair amount of the bands that've come out of that scene, but the "scene" part, I can do without.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

I always had people wanting to contribute really eviscerating music reviews and book reviews to Blue Blood. I think internet coverage can afford to be a bit more mixed, but, if I was going to spend all that $$$$$$$$$$ to put ink on paper, I couldn't see wasting the space on being negative. I still think it only makes sense to do negative coverage on something if it is newsworthy. Like if some guy in his basement puts a sucky bunch of songs on his ******* profile, I do not think it is appropriate to write a review taking his music apart. If an important or otherwise well-known artist puts out a disappointing album, then that is news. Basically, I think something needs to be newsworthy and, when putting ink on paper, it seems like it makes the most sense to just not cover something which sucks.

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Yeah, that's my thinking too, though I usually do make an exception for Metallica, despite their decline not really being news anymore.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

Was Sean as much of an unappreciative little bitch to Propaganda as to everyone else who has ever shown him any kindness or support in his miserable life? For the record, although old skool folks probably know I had to sue Fred, I did like his magazine and his work, and I'm not about to look for the negative there either, just because he treated me badly.

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Shhhh, he'll hear you and then you'll never get him to leave your forum, no matter how many times you and Forrest bring the banhammer down. ;)

That having been said, I'll take the extraordinarily diplomatic route here, given my experiences, and simply say that he was always nice to Fred to my knowledge.

Speaking of, you sued Fred? No shit. (All I had to do was bug him repeatedly to mail back my copy of "Genito-Urinary Diseases And Syphillis", 1904 edition. Darenzia eventually got him to cough it up, pardon the pun, and as of a few years ago, we were on friendly terms again.) Again, after my time (I was gone by the summer of '95), so I missed that. That's unusual. He was usually pretty good about paying folks for things, at least, though he and Paul made some real head-scratcher editorial decisions at times, particularly where music was concerned.