"Control" Your Temper?

So: Last month I dressed some people down after a lousy performance. It was the first time I had lost my temper at a show. Do people believe one should always control one's temper in the name of civility? This was not on the silly internet. I spoke directly to their faces and offered to meet up with any who were not there.

I believe one generally should not sweat the small stuff. At the same time, I don't think repressed anger is a healthy thing. If you engage in activities where you are putting forth time, effort, and money on behalf of others ... I don't see how you can even ethically remain reticent when people don't pull their own weight.

It frustrates me as I know I will end up doing a lot more myself and collaborating a lot less with others. I don't mind getting bashed for that to be honest. I will know I made the effort already. I just don't know that civility for the sake of it is always a good thing. (in real life) Internet quarrels are futile. Obviously, it does spill over online. This is legitimate when it is the same people trying to thwart your actual efforts though.

OEC

You ask the tough questions.

I used to always, like 100% of the time, tell everyone precisely where they stood with me at all times. I was very immediate with both praise and concern. Didn't matter if the person was my punk rock pal who could take it and knew we were friends or my boss at whatever.

At some point, I started biting my tongue. I think I got overly chill about things and let some people push things too far, particularly in situations where they were not pulling their own weight and I had to take up their slack.

Hard to decide on the best middle ground for yourself and those you care about.

I try to control my temper, especially in work environments. Unfortunately, I'll let so many things go that it builds up and then I completely snap and start cussing and yelling at everyone. It's not too bad when it's a job you can walk out of, but not so much when you're in a contract and there's the whole rank structure thing...

I think there is an Art to civility. Or at least there should be... I think that there should be a time and place to be civil, but that doesn't necessarily mean not speaking your opinion.

I also think that most of the time, its best to let yourself loose your temper if its the kind of thing that will bug you the rest of the week. You know, you don't say anything and it sits there like an itch.

Yes, there are consequences to being 'that person'. But I think in the end being how you want to be is a way to wade through the maggot's covering the corpse, and get down to the real meat per se.

No one should hold their tongue 100% of the time. People you respect deserve held tongues, civility, and ginger language. Its how you show someone respect.

On the other hand, I hate being in a 'safe' environment full of a majority of intellects I respect, and have someone tear through with their snarky honesty.

All in all, I think the more experience you have, the more you can be rational about when its well worth it to loose your temper with the maggots, and when its beyond worth.

I try and be civil but sometimes you have to yell to get a point across.

if i get to the point where i am loosing my temper... it's to late and you had better get out of the way...

it takes a lot to get me to that point and you can tell i'm there because i stop yelling and get very quiet...

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

You ask the tough questions.

I used to always, like 100% of the time, tell everyone precisely where they stood with me at all times. I was very immediate with both praise and concern. Didn't matter if the person was my punk rock pal who could take it and knew we were friends or my boss at whatever.

At some point, I started biting my tongue. I think I got overly chill about things and let some people push things too far, particularly in situations where they were not pulling their own weight and I had to take up their slack.

Hard to decide on the best middle ground for yourself and those you care about.

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The specific bands there handled it fine. They knew we fucked up. They'll all have been on national tickets I've done come next month. There was just a lot of other disloyalty and treachery going on. (Thus my caveat as to any others who wanted to discuss their actions with me in person) We had to part company with a few people we were working with. Problem being: I basically have to bite my tongue until after February. I have to choose social expediency over saying my peace regarding those who went beyond not working a night hard enough ... these folks had no loyalty to any of us involved.

It mostly sucks as I'll be in the clear as of then. My sites are nearly finished and I have an opportunity to route a tour. The timing of it all could not have been worse. Like a lot of people in town, I took a substantial financial hit (these other folks simply exacerbated it).

OEC

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Originally Posted by nathanmbailey

I try to control my temper, especially in work environments. Unfortunately, I'll let so many things go that it builds up and then I completely snap and start cussing and yelling at everyone. It's not too bad when it's a job you can walk out of, but not so much when you're in a contract and there's the whole rank structure thing...

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I am the boss. Regardless of what I did, the venue is meticulous. I have the same booking privileges as before. Throwing events kind of puts you in an odd grey area.

OEC

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Originally Posted by Wickedanima

I think there is an Art to civility. Or at least there should be... I think that there should be a time and place to be civil, but that doesn't necessarily mean not speaking your opinion.

I also think that most of the time, its best to let yourself loose your temper if its the kind of thing that will bug you the rest of the week. You know, you don't say anything and it sits there like an itch.

Yes, there are consequences to being 'that person'. But I think in the end being how you want to be is a way to wade through the maggot's covering the corpse, and get down to the real meat per se.

No one should hold their tongue 100% of the time. People you respect deserve held tongues, civility, and ginger language. Its how you show someone respect.

On the other hand, I hate being in a 'safe' environment full of a majority of intellects I respect, and have someone tear through with their snarky honesty.

All in all, I think the more experience you have, the more you can be rational about when its well worth it to loose your temper with the maggots, and when its beyond worth.

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The actual maggots are still out there truth be told. That's kind of the conundrum now.

OEC

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Originally Posted by jonny.illuminati

if i get to the point where i am loosing my temper... it's to late and you had better get out of the way...

it takes a lot to get me to that point and you can tell i'm there because i stop yelling and get very quiet...

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Never got to that point luckily.

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Originally Posted by Velvet-Tongue

I try and be civil but sometimes you have to yell to get a point across.

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haha I definitely made my point.

I think it also depends on the level of activity you're doing.

Eating out at a resturant and the server is slow? Take a chill pill man.

Have to wait 10 mins longer to get your oil changes? Slow down max.

Putting on a huge event and everyone is sitting around spouting internet memes and being lazy slackjaws? Its yellin time.

When you have alot of money, time and an audience to worry about someone putting that in jeopardy causes rage.

There's few things as utterly dreary and impractical as civility. When information is the purpose of communication, what could be worse than a set of random restrictions serving only to indulge sensitivities created and sustained, circularly, by its own popular application? And everyone knows that the world is full of idiots; representing yourself as you really feel about them is due to avoid cognitive dissonance where it hurts the most: your identity.

Hehe. On the other hand, who ever wants to be upset? 'Temper' concerns a feeling, which can inspire an opinion but does not constitute one. Unexpressed feelings stop being bothersome as soon as they fade; it's only the ones that anchored themselves into memory by prompting matching intellectual positions that build up on the long term as something that can be stressful if 'repressed'. Beyond the critical thought it may motivate, anger has nothing useful to contribute; and thoughts are usually best saved or discarded on a true/false basis (or whatever approximation one can manage). By letting it shape an opinion and expressing it immediately you're absorbing it into your social identity, which works inwardly to stimulate recurrence. Similarly, if you can deny it a hold on how you think about whatever the focus of your anger was (preferably only when this is justified), 'repressing' it can be a perfectly valid way to get rid of it cleanly and to desirable effect.

If the said person can somehow help me in later situations, I usually do the nicey-nice thing, bite my tongue, treat 'em with kid gloves, what have you. If they have nothing to bring to the table, I usually say "fuck it!" and tell it like it is.

Stress sucks though and if you let it build up too much and do nothing, it leads to health issues, mental and physical.

I've been told all my life that I'm 'just like my father'. As in, 'one hell of a temper'. I'm actually a lot better now but I have been known to throw shit around (read: at people). I'm really trying not to let stupid shit bother me, but if you really piss me off then watch the fuck out.
On the subject of people not pulling their weight, I deal with that every bloody day at work. It's seriously frustrating because I wonder...why does this person still work here??? Here I am busting my ass and this jackass is cleaning out his wallet. True story. Those people need to be told where it's at, for sure.

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Originally Posted by One Eyed Cat

The actual maggots are still out there truth be told. That's kind of the conundrum now.

OEC

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But isn't that always the conundrum?

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Originally Posted by Wickedanima

But isn't that always the conundrum?

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It's one that remains, sure. Was a total start-up for me. The learning curve is fairly steep in this environment. I'm not "rich", but I have enough disposable income to lose money at first and recoup it later. I still will do so. It was just amazing the amount of resistance I got from "within". Libel. Inept designer. Low draw bands who didn't work even if I outlayed everything in advance.

I feel a lot of people would rather see others fail just to drag them down to their "level". Being an outsider here, I have been lucky to recently meet people who do get shit done and don't goof around like that.

OEC

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Originally Posted by Ajax Knucklebones

If the said person can somehow help me in later situations, I usually do the nicey-nice thing, bite my tongue, treat 'em with kid gloves, what have you. If they have nothing to bring to the table, I usually say "fuck it!" and tell it like it is.

Stress sucks though and if you let it build up too much and do nothing, it leads to health issues, mental and physical.

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Yah I said what I had to basically. None of the people there held it against me actually.

OEC

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Originally Posted by Raza

There's few things as utterly dreary and impractical as civility. When information is the purpose of communication, what could be worse than a set of random restrictions serving only to indulge sensitivities created and sustained, circularly, by its own popular application? And everyone knows that the world is full of idiots; representing yourself as you really feel about them is due to avoid cognitive dissonance where it hurts the most: your identity.

Hehe. On the other hand, who ever wants to be upset? 'Temper' concerns a feeling, which can inspire an opinion but does not constitute one. Unexpressed feelings stop being bothersome as soon as they fade; it's only the ones that anchored themselves into memory by prompting matching intellectual positions that build up on the long term as something that can be stressful if 'repressed'. Beyond the critical thought it may motivate, anger has nothing useful to contribute; and thoughts are usually best saved or discarded on a true/false basis (or whatever approximation one can manage). By letting it shape an opinion and expressing it immediately you're absorbing it into your social identity, which works inwardly to stimulate recurrence. Similarly, if you can deny it a hold on how you think about whatever the focus of your anger was (preferably only when this is justified), 'repressing' it can be a perfectly valid way to get rid of it cleanly and to desirable effect.

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Clearly, the world is full of idiots. It's just when you have people slag on you to the actual detriment of a show, it pisses you off. I find it odd as it seems some of the folks most vocal about "supporting" music are the first to attempt to destroy it in any and every way possible.

It didn't have a long term affect on me. I can hold my tongue when need be. Once you accept an additional cadre is composed of slaggers, you stop being angry. They can't help being that way. They're just losers.

OEC

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Originally Posted by Velvet-Tongue

I think it also depends on the level of activity you're doing.

Eating out at a resturant and the server is slow? Take a chill pill man.

Have to wait 10 mins longer to get your oil changes? Slow down max.

Putting on a huge event and everyone is sitting around spouting internet memes and being lazy slackjaws? Its yellin time.

When you have alot of money, time and an audience to worry about someone putting that in jeopardy causes rage.

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True. I never even honk my horn personally. Things like that are irrelevant. You go to a different restaurant or Jiffy Lube or what have you.

OEC

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Originally Posted by mystoo

I've been told all my life that I'm 'just like my father'. As in, 'one hell of a temper'. I'm actually a lot better now but I have been known to throw shit around (read: at people). I'm really trying not to let stupid shit bother me, but if you really piss me off then watch the fuck out.
On the subject of people not pulling their weight, I deal with that every bloody day at work. It's seriously frustrating because I wonder...why does this person still work here??? Here I am busting my ass and this jackass is cleaning out his wallet. True story. Those people need to be told where it's at, for sure.

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I've always had a hard time in those sort of work environments. I think some people just have a sense of entitlement. They'll learn in time.

OEC

I think well considered use of your temper can be an effective thing. Some people use their tempers as a false way of getting what they think is respect. I suppose it depends on how you're wielding it as to how appropriate or effective it is.

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Originally Posted by Nudemuse

I think well considered use of your temper can be an effective thing. Some people use their tempers as a false way of getting what they think is respect. I suppose it depends on how you're wielding it as to how appropriate or effective it is.

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It was effective in that instance. We still lost a bill, but I get calls for bookings from the same venue still. Some of the bands hurt themselves. The venue saw we made an effort. The pros will see things for what they are generally. The people present were and remain my friends. We are having to be more realistic though. Minneapolis is a tough town. I don't think people always understand who they hurt when they slag on others. There are very few people who will independently book and promote shows in a number of genres here now. They end up losing the shows. Us? As we say "It is what it is." You grab a vodka sour and work out something financially feasible on one or both coasts. I haven't given up on the city by any means, but I have to give every performer I work with an honest assessment of the situation.

OEC

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Originally Posted by One Eyed Cat

Clearly, the world is full of idiots. It's just when you have people slag on you to the actual detriment of a show, it pisses you off. I find it odd as it seems some of the folks most vocal about "supporting" music are the first to attempt to destroy it in any and every way possible.

It didn't have a long term affect on me. I can hold my tongue when need be. Once you accept an additional cadre is composed of slaggers, you stop being angry. They can't help being that way. They're just losers.

OEC

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I'm actually pretty sure you're doing the rationalization thing here. The fashion is fairly generic, so the long term effect will probably just be in increased measure of professional cynicism.

Which is obvious, obviously, but still begs the question of whether you want that, and if not, whether now that you're not pissed off anymore there's no way to adapt your position towards the positive without losing any essential meaning.

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Originally Posted by Raza

I'm actually pretty sure you're doing the rationalization thing here. The fashion is fairly generic, so the long term effect will probably just be in increased measure of professional cynicism.

Which is obvious, obviously, but still begs the question of whether you want that, and if not, whether now that you're not pissed off anymore there's no way to adapt your position towards the positive without losing any essential meaning.

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You are way overanalyzing me and the situation. This is a minor part of what you deal with. I am optimistic moving forward. We dropped the dead weight. Hired one of the best designers in the business. Have seen what works and what doesn't now. Starting up is trial and error.

OEC

I don't doubt that you've got a lot more going on than your opinion and memory of that particular handful of disappointing people; something that definitely goes to both your credit and benefit. I think that what I said applies to it for what (little?) impact the scenario and your approach to it do have, though, and wasn't that the topic at hand?

Obviously as an individual you are far more than the product of that single encounter, and it will not define or even describe you. But it will contribute, and paying heed to all those little things pays off on the long term.

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Originally Posted by Raza

I don't doubt that you've got a lot more going on than your opinion and memory of that particular handful of disappointing people; something that definitely goes to both your credit and benefit. I think that what I said applies to it for what (little?) impact the scenario and your approach to it do have, though, and wasn't that the topic at hand?

Obviously as an individual you are far more than the product of that single encounter, and it will not define or even describe you. But it will contribute, and paying heed to all those little things pays off on the long term.

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True. I was ranting to some extent. It's been a great ride overall. I've become friends with some great musicians. I feel I can make a small difference in their careers (I can set up events in other places now). It kind of amazes me who is falling through the cracks. The local shows have been more mixed. I think I need to stick more to the genres and artists and I'm more familiar with and love.

OEC

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Originally Posted by One Eyed Cat

The actual maggots are still out there truth be told. That's kind of the conundrum now.

OEC

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maggots do have thier vital purpose though

Are you not able to talk about the band/venue names. I'm super curious.

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Originally Posted by One Eyed Cat

It's one that remains, sure. Was a total start-up for me. The learning curve is fairly steep in this environment. I'm not "rich", but I have enough disposable income to lose money at first and recoup it later. I still will do so. It was just amazing the amount of resistance I got from "within". Libel. Inept designer. Low draw bands who didn't work even if I outlayed everything in advance.

I feel a lot of people would rather see others fail just to drag them down to their "level". Being an outsider here, I have been lucky to recently meet people who do get shit done and don't goof around like that.

OEC

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Starts are frequently rough. ^_^ Just keep trying.

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Originally Posted by jonny.illuminati

it takes a lot to get me to that point and you can tell i'm there because i stop yelling and get very quiet...

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Sounds familiar :)

OEC. Be honest to your self. Don't let the bad emotions build up. Just get it out in nicest way you can. That's what I do. Yelling never helped anyone than warlords.

True about genres. Do the stuff you like, not what others like. For example, when I do music if I concentrate to make it more acceptable by masses then it starts to suck.

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Originally Posted by Toe Cutter

Are you not able to talk about the band/venue names. I'm super curious.

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Message me and I'll tell you. It wasn't a big deal overall. I generally don't mention names in a public forum. Some positive changes are going on here though too. Don't read into this as all inclusive. People are working together more out of necessity. It may surprise you given you've been around for a bit.

OEC

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Originally Posted by OliX

OEC. Be honest to your self. Don't let the bad emotions build up. Just get it out in nicest way you can. That's what I do. Yelling never helped anyone than warlords.

True about genres. Do the stuff you like, not what others like. For example, when I do music if I concentrate to make it more acceptable by masses then it starts to suck.

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It wasn't ugly. I was just pretty brutal but honest. We're all still friends in terms of the people that were there.

OEC

i guess many people would describe me as hostile, so no.

I just dont really get angry. Annoyed and frustraded yes but lost it compleatly? only a few times xD