In honor of the Democratic LGBT Debate tonight, what are your views on Gay Marriage?

What do you think a president should do? What do you think is the ideal situation?

Ideal? Full marriage rights and responsibilities for same-sex couples. It is a complex battle legally. I'd start by overturning DOMA and DADT. Then, I'd go back to working on a state by state strategy. I'm not sure how a President would implement civil unions. I suppose it could imply recognition of federal but not states' rights equivalent to that of marriage. States have historically defined marriage. I'm not opposed to a uniform definition, but I want to be pragmatic enough to win. I would favor all anti-discrimination laws being applied to sexual orientation at once.

Jackie T

I should add: CALL IT MARRIAGE! I'm for using the term marriage in all instances.

Jackie T

Ideally I think the president and everyone else should leave other people the hell alone.

In other words repeal and overturn all the laws/statutes/etc and make it simple. You're an adult? Want to marry someone? Fill out the paperwork, do the blood test get your certificate and go. Regardless of sexual orientation. I am so finished with this whole argument it's such a waste of time.

If someone wants to get married they should be able to do it; whether it be to the opposite sex, the same sex, your pet sheep, whatever... I think it's wrong to take choices away from people.... people should mind thier own fucking business.

and there's my three cents.

personally im against marriage completely. but as long as straights can get married then i believe gays should be able to as well. there isnt a single (non-religious... but lets not go there) reason to not allow gay marriage, and as long as it remains impossible for same-sex couples to get married the longer those responsible are being openly discriminatory... which should really get them in a bit of trouble, i think.

seems like a pretty stupid question to ask in this community though... a fair few of the people here are pretty open minded and tolerant of others.

I'm upset/surprised that only two of the candidates support gay marriage.

And I agree with every poster above. Well, except VoltaireBlue. I can't support bestiality.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VoltaireBlue

If someone wants to get married they should be able to do it; whether it be to the opposite sex, the same sex, your pet sheep, whatever... I think it's wrong to take choices away from people.... people should mind thier own fucking business.

and there's my three cents.

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Agree except for the pet sheep. A civil marriage is a mutual endeavor which entails some 1100+ federal rights and responsibilities + those of a given state. A pet sheep cannot consent to marry or carry out the responsibilities. I assume you do not mean a consummated marriage here.:thumb:

Jackie T

(I do support the inclusion of pets in wills etc)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lady Alias

I'm upset/surprised that only two of the candidates support gay marriage.

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It didn't surprise me. They're trying to be "moderate" in their stances. The only party that supports same-sex marriage in the terms marriage is currently defined is: http://www.greenpartyus.org
The Libertarian Party has an interesting stance: http://www.lp.org
Both would seem, in their own ways, to put everyone on equal feeting.

Jackie T

/sigh
Yeah, I know. Just trying to win favour with both sides. I guess I had 'crazy liberal' in my head from watching too much Fox and it melded with wishful thinking.

P.S.

I abhor debate audiences. Very much.
Question: Y/N?
Canidade: Weellll.../in a rising tone 'I think the sky is very beautiful and unites all of us together!'
Audiance: CLAPCLAPCLAP
Viewer: /weeps

They are worse than a laugh track on a sitcom.

In the UK, they call it civil partnerships, and anyone can have one. No matter what you and your partner's sex is, you should have the right to make a PERMANENT and LEGAL conmittment to each other! People too often get engaged but don't go the whole hog and get married. I have nothing against gay people, some of my friends are gay, and they know that I am straight and they are fine with that. Why should I feel any different about what they do behind closed doors? If they aren't harming anyone (or at least not hurting them without their consent) what is the difference?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lady Alias

/sigh
Yeah, I know. Just trying to win favour with both sides. I guess I had 'crazy liberal' in my head from watching too much Fox and it melded with wishful thinking.

P.S.

I abhor debate audiences. Very much.
Question: Y/N?
Canidade: Weellll.../in a rising tone 'I think the sky is very beautiful and unites all of us together!'
Audiance: CLAPCLAPCLAP
Viewer: /weeps

They are worse than a laugh track on a sitcom.

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Obama pretty much blew it with his Pakistan comments. What he said may happen, but it isn't something you say aloud. I don't see anyone catching Hillary now. So if anyone can figure out which way the wind blows when she puts her hand in the air, we'll have a better idea of what may actually happen.

Jackie T

With the Christian side of the nation so firmly against Obama he does not have a chance at all. The Night Auditor for the hotel I guard told me that on christian radio across the nation they're "fighting" against Obama because his election would let all those "evil Muslims" into the country.

Hillary likewise does not have a chance due to her image as a dominatrix by most of America and her being a female (alot of the country won't support her, you just watch. They'll be against her silentlly but it'll be done). Plus with the mind frame of the Muslim countries, having a woman president will only serve to alienate us from that part of the world even further.

The Democrats in my opinion fucked up to a massive degree with their extreme candidates. They need a single normal, average guy. Thats the strength of the Republicans. They know a very small population of America is idealistic and thinks beyond image.

Thats not to say their canidates are bad either. Giulliani will get my vote unless I see some impressive counter debates. He destroyed the Mob in New York and held the city together after 9/11. Hes a powerful symbol and a senior politican loved by his people. Hes the first "heroic" presidential candidate I've seen in my lifetime.

Dream Team:

Giulliani as President, Obama as Vice President (His mixed heritage and muslim roots would be a GREAT foreign policy aid at this point in time. Plus hes full of fire and is young. As Vice president he could use that power as a diplomat.)

Oh..oh and Gay Marriage yeah. It's none of my business to be against their marriages. They're not performing it in any churches that would be against it to my knowledge (If they tried getting it done in a Catholic church the pope would excommunicate the priest and the gay couple as well, thus invalidating the marriage..atleast religiouslly.)

Let people get married and love eachother.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Velvet-Tongue

With the Christian side of the nation so firmly against Obama he does not have a chance at all. The Night Auditor for the hotel I guard told me that on christian radio across the nation they're "fighting" against Obama because his election would let all those "evil Muslims" into the country.

Hillary likewise does not have a chance due to her image as a dominatrix by most of America and her being a female (alot of the country won't support her, you just watch. They'll be against her silentlly but it'll be done). Plus with the mind frame of the Muslim countries, having a woman president will only serve to alienate us from that part of the world even further.

The Democrats in my opinion fucked up to a massive degree with their extreme candidates. They need a single normal, average guy. Thats the strength of the Republicans. They know a very small population of America is idealistic and thinks beyond image.

Thats not to say their canidates are bad either. Giulliani will get my vote unless I see some impressive counter debates. He destroyed the Mob in New York and held the city together after 9/11. Hes a powerful symbol and a senior politican loved by his people. Hes the first "heroic" presidential candidate I've seen in my lifetime.

Dream Team:

Giulliani as President, Obama as Vice President (His mixed heritage and muslim roots would be a GREAT foreign policy aid at this point in time. Plus hes full of fire and is young. As Vice president he could use that power as a diplomat.)

Oh..oh and Gay Marriage yeah. It's none of my business to be against their marriages. They're not performing it in any churches that would be against it to my knowledge (If they tried getting it done in a Catholic church the pope would excommunicate the priest and the gay couple as well, thus invalidating the marriage..atleast religiouslly.)

Let people get married and love eachother.

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***guess who the majority of voters are? Union men, people in the south, church groups. With the amazing apathy exhibited by my generation is a further deathblow towards progressive politicans. Untill all the College kids and young adults can stop shouting how their vote means nothing and put down the damn xbox controller and go vote nothign will be changed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Velvet-Tongue

With the Christian side of the nation so firmly against Obama he does not have a chance at all. The Night Auditor for the hotel I guard told me that on christian radio across the nation they're "fighting" against Obama because his election would let all those "evil Muslims" into the country.

Hillary likewise does not have a chance due to her image as a dominatrix by most of America and her being a female (alot of the country won't support her, you just watch. They'll be against her silentlly but it'll be done). Plus with the mind frame of the Muslim countries, having a woman president will only serve to alienate us from that part of the world even further.

The Democrats in my opinion fucked up to a massive degree with their extreme candidates. They need a single normal, average guy. Thats the strength of the Republicans. They know a very small population of America is idealistic and thinks beyond image.

Thats not to say their canidates are bad either. Giulliani will get my vote unless I see some impressive counter debates. He destroyed the Mob in New York and held the city together after 9/11. Hes a powerful symbol and a senior politican loved by his people. Hes the first "heroic" presidential candidate I've seen in my lifetime.

Dream Team:

Giulliani as President, Obama as Vice President (His mixed heritage and muslim roots would be a GREAT foreign policy aid at this point in time. Plus hes full of fire and is young. As Vice president he could use that power as a diplomat.)

Oh..oh and Gay Marriage yeah. It's none of my business to be against their marriages. They're not performing it in any churches that would be against it to my knowledge (If they tried getting it done in a Catholic church the pope would excommunicate the priest and the gay couple as well, thus invalidating the marriage..atleast religiouslly.)

Let people get married and love eachother.

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All the same-sex marriage bills I've seen in states are just for civil marriage. Churches need not sanction it (although some would). I think this is fair.

I wouldn't vote for Giuliani. I say this strictly due to his promise to nominate more "strict constructionists" to the federal bench. In reality, these are simply deeply conservative Justices who will craft opinions based on their own personal morality (all Justices do, these folks I consider dangerous). This was Rudy's olive branch to social conservatives. He knows better. He was a practicing attorney and nominated a wide variety of jurists as Mayor of NYC. I have problems with both conservative and liberal jurisprudence, but I think another Scalia on SCOTUS would be very damaging to the country. It is ironic as Rudy is pro-choice. Abortion would become a matter for states to decide. The decisions would have further implications in other areas of personal liberties not specifically enumerated in the Constitution. These folks seem to skip over the 9th and have a novel reading of the 14th inconsistent with both its language and the intent behind it.

Jackie T

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Velvet-Tongue

***guess who the majority of voters are? Union men, people in the south, church groups. With the amazing apathy exhibited by my generation is a further deathblow towards progressive politicans. Untill all the College kids and young adults can stop shouting how their vote means nothing and put down the damn xbox controller and go vote nothign will be changed.

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Yes. I will have the right to point fingers at the twits. It will amuse me greatly. :1orglaugh :thumb:

Jackie T

Now now Velvet... There are many People In The South that are not the ones you see on TV... And many people in the US in general who are ignorant fools. That's not confined to the South East.

As for Gay marriage, there's no reason on earth it should be illegal. Honestly, except for a bunch of people continuing to play lip service to the people that line their pockets.

All a bunch of silliness. I think if Gay marriage is banned, all marriage should be. ^_^ But I'm also deeply in favor of the marriage thing to be licenced and renewed every five years. If you don't want to renew? Oh well. No divorce.

Velvet lives in the South.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lady Alias

Velvet lives in the South.

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I won't blame southern conservatives. If they win, it will have been due to the apathy Velvet speaks of. Those are the people I'd blame. It really goes way beyond voting too. I don't know that I could vote for a major party candidate.

Jackie T

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wickedanima

Now now Velvet... There are many People In The South that are not the ones you see on TV... And many people in the US in general who are ignorant fools. That's not confined to the South East.

As for Gay marriage, there's no reason on earth it should be illegal. Honestly, except for a bunch of people continuing to play lip service to the people that line their pockets.

All a bunch of silliness. I think if Gay marriage is banned, all marriage should be. ^_^ But I'm also deeply in favor of the marriage thing to be licenced and renewed every five years. If you don't want to renew? Oh well. No divorce.

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A lot of the midwest is probably more hardcore than the south. I see a libertarian streak in the south still. There is none in the rural midwest.

Jackie T