Letters I've written totally meaning to send . . .

What do you do when there are things you really wish you could make someone else understand . . . when you know that (a) there is probably no getting anything through their thick head and (b) it wouldn't really make a difference if you did communicate successfully to them? I find it so difficult not to try to educate people when they are being unreasonable, even though any interaction at all with unreasonable people usually just makes them more unpleasantly unreasonable and not more rational.

Do you go ahead and communicate with (really at) irrational and unreasonable people?

Do you write down your thoughts and not send them or speak to the person?

Or do you just put it out of mind?

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

What do you do when there are things you really wish you could make someone else understand . . . when you know that (a) there is probably no getting anything through their thick head and (b) it wouldn't really make a difference if you did communicate successfully to them? I find it so difficult not to try to educate people when they are being unreasonable, even though any interaction at all with unreasonable people usually just makes them more unpleasantly unreasonable and not more rational.

Do you go ahead and communicate with (really at) irrational and unreasonable people?

Do you write down your thoughts and not send them or speak to the person?

Or do you just put it out of mind?

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I had an incident recently where it just got worse the harder I tried. You might write it conceptually (lessons to learn from your experience with this person) Beyond that, it sounds like you better let go. It will either make you unhappy or want to strike back.

JT

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Originally Posted by Jackie T.

I had an incident recently where it just got worse the harder I tried. You might write it conceptually (lessons to learn from your experience with this person) Beyond that, it sounds like you better let go. It will either make you unhappy or want to strike back.

JT

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That sounds about right to me. Unfortunately, there are some people who, for whatever reason of their own, are gonna hold to their views, no matter what one says or does, short of using physical force or killing them outright.

Since those latter two options are generally off the table, and for damned good reason, best to leave the person to figure out their own answers for themselves, or not at all.

Their lives, their choices, and sometimes, all one can do is stand back and make sure that one isn't around when they mess themselves up.

Depends on how close one is to the person, too. But, even then, sometimes, it's best to back off a bit for a while, if one is close to the person making whatever choices they are doing, then come back if and when they're perhaps more willing to listen to whatever advice you've to give.

Wow, Amelia, it sounds like you're trying to communicate with my Mom-In-Law. She actually tried telling me the other day that she knows some one else who did porn and its all a very shady business where the girls are kidnapped and held at gun point to do shoots for the Russian mafia. And that's about the sanest thing she's claimed to be an expert on. She tried to make me pay the late fees on a bill she asked me to pay for her, the day it was due, when i was doing something else. *tears out hair*Communicating at her will make you want to shoot things, prolly her. I have a very thick letter explaining everything I've ever wanted to say to her ever, that she'll prolly "tl;dr" but i plan on giving it to her when we leave any way. In the mean time, yes i"m going completely out of my mind.

~K

Well I did that but sent it ... then Mom had a nervous break down ... probably not going to do that again.

Telling loons that their thoughts or arguments are loony, usually makes them act even more loony. I don't put their stupidity out of my mind, but I try not to engage or get caught up in what ever craziness they're spouting. As the old phrase goes: "Never argue with a pig. It makes you look stupid and it annoys the pig."

I keep a diary and I rant and rave, I also draw inspiration from my problems for my lyrics.
But there has been one time I was just so frustrated with a guy I'd been seeing, it was a failed relationship but I kept wanting to be with him even though I thought he didn't want a bar of me. I ended up writing a four page letter to him but never sending it. I cried my heart out as I was writing it, and again as I read it to myself. I then read it to my counsellor and afterwards I felt so much better.

Oh yeah, and we've sorted things out.

But normally I will just keep the thoughts to myself. I do art and I write poetry and songs, so my thoughts usually go into that. It's a good way to vent without saying something to somebody that I'm going to regret.

no point trying to comunicate with loons unless you have time to kill and couldn't care if you get a rational response or not cause, well, thier loons

had one for a nieghbour and he finaly moved out this weekend...yay

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Originally Posted by Donald Rilea

That sounds about right to me. Unfortunately, there are some people who, for whatever reason of their own, are gonna hold to their views, no matter what one says or does, short of using physical force or killing them outright.

Since those latter two options are generally off the table, and for damned good reason, best to leave the person to figure out their own answers for themselves, or not at all.

Their lives, their choices, and sometimes, all one can do is stand back and make sure that one isn't around when they mess themselves up.

Depends on how close one is to the person, too. But, even then, sometimes, it's best to back off a bit for a while, if one is close to the person making whatever choices they are doing, then come back if and when they're perhaps more willing to listen to whatever advice you've to give.

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Yeah. I've caused myself a lot of grief both by reacting (and sometimes goofing with) folks who won't listen to reason. I always fancied myself "The Champion of Lost Causes". Looking back, these were precisely the types of cases where the champ threw himself into the abyss. I have this specifically written down on a list of things to work on now. You entwine yourself in these people's lives, it gets hard to set yourself free. They will not forget or forgive, that I can guarantee.

I'm still honest, brutal, probably crazy, but I know when I cross a line. You read something from your own perspective. What will happen: Their interpretation will be something completely different. There is just no good option here.

JT

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Originally Posted by Donald Rilea

That sounds about right to me. Unfortunately, there are some people who, for whatever reason of their own, are gonna hold to their views, no matter what one says or does, short of using physical force or killing them outright.

Since those latter two options are generally off the table, and for damned good reason, best to leave the person to figure out their own answers for themselves, or not at all.

Their lives, their choices, and sometimes, all one can do is stand back and make sure that one isn't around when they mess themselves up.

Depends on how close one is to the person, too. But, even then, sometimes, it's best to back off a bit for a while, if one is close to the person making whatever choices they are doing, then come back if and when they're perhaps more willing to listen to whatever advice you've to give.

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Unfortunatly- sometimes when the loonies start drowning in their loony-ness sometimes they'll blame you! Its their favourite game! *points gun at head*

Deep breath, happy thoughts - the sun is warm, the grass is green - only forty more days of this and its all over. Forever.

~K

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Originally Posted by Jackie T.

Yeah. I've caused myself a lot of grief both by reacting (and sometimes goofing with) folks who won't listen to reason. I always fancied myself "The Champion of Lost Causes". Looking back, these were precisely the types of cases where the champ threw himself into the abyss. I have this specifically written down on a list of things to work on now. You entwine yourself in these people's lives, it gets hard to set yourself free. They will not forget or forgive, that I can guarantee.

I'm still honest, brutal, probably crazy, but I know when I cross a line. You read something from your own perspective. What will happen: Their interpretation will be something completely different. There is just no good option here.

JT

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Hell, I have a bit of that in me, too. But, I also know that whatever resources, knowledge, etc, are really, and this depends on the individual person and his or her problems, generally quite puny in comparison to the size and scope of those problems.

Whenever I can, I try as best I can to hook them up with people who have more in the way of access to resources and potential solutions to that person's problems than I do.

Sometimes, it takes, and other times, it doesn't, and, as aggravating as that can be for me at times, it's that person's choice, and their right as a free person.

And sometimes, what they don't even really need is advice or references, but just someone the individual can use as a kind of sounding board, while they try and mentally work out solutions to their problems.

Some people do that better out loud than in the confines of their heads, and that's cool.

However one deals with a problem or crisis, so long as one doesn't end up harming oneself or others, is fine by me, because I ain't God(yet another blow to my ego here!!!:1orglaugh ), and I ain't met the old bugger yet(at least not that I know of), so, in the end, all I can do is offer an ear, what I hope the individual will find to be sound advice, whatever limited access I can to others who have more resources and knowledge than I do, and the freedom and privacy for them to work out their problems and lives in their own ways.

Me, I'm a stubborn, middle-aged bugger with a hard head, both literally and metaphorically, and I ain't that good at forcing people to do my bidding.

Then again, if I were, I'd be a right arsehole, now, wouldn't I????:1orglaugh

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Originally Posted by keiko

Unfortunatly- sometimes when the loonies start drowning in their loony-ness sometimes they'll blame you! Its their favourite game! *points gun at head*

Deep breath, happy thoughts - the sun is warm, the grass is green - only forty more days of this and its all over. Forever.

~K

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haha Your goose is cooked once they started pointing the finger back. That also happened to me recently (and will likely cause some permanent social unease 'round here) Luckily, I lived with Bay Area punks back in the day. I can take insane amounts of passive hostility and laugh it off. It takes just that once to lose your cool and make it worse though.

JT

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Originally Posted by Donald Rilea

Hell, I have a bit of that in me, too. But, I also know that whatever resources, knowledge, etc, are really, and this depends on the individual person and his or her problems, generally quite puny in comparison to the size and scope of those problems.

Whenever I can, I try as best I can to hook them up with people who have more in the way of access to resources and potential solutions to that person's problems than I do.

Sometimes, it takes, and other times, it doesn't, and, as aggravating as that can be for me at times, it's that person's choice, and their right as a free person.

And sometimes, what they don't even really need is advice or references, but just someone the individual can use as a kind of sounding board, while they try and mentally work out solutions to their problems.

Some people do that better out loud than in the confines of their heads, and that's cool.

However one deals with a problem or crisis, so long as one doesn't end up harming oneself or others, is fine by me, because I ain't God(yet another blow to my ego here!!!:1orglaugh ), and I ain't met the old bugger yet(at least not that I know of), so, in the end, all I can do is offer an ear, what I hope the individual will find to be sound advice, whatever limited access I can to others who have more resources and knowledge than I do, and the freedom and privacy for them to work out their problems and lives in their own ways.

Me, I'm a stubborn, middle-aged bugger with a hard head, both literally and metaphorically, and I ain't that good at forcing people to do my bidding.

Then again, if I were, I'd be a right arsehole, now, wouldn't I????:1orglaugh

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I do have some charm in the Camus' sense of getting what I want without asking specifically. In tese cases: Watch what you wish for.

JT

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Originally Posted by Jackie T.

haha Your goose is cooked once they started pointing the finger back. That also happened to me recently (and will likely cause some permanent social unease 'round here) Luckily, I lived with Bay Area punks back in the day. I can take insane amounts of passive hostility and laugh it off. It takes just that once to lose your cool and make it worse though.

JT

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The fingers pointing back at you imagery makes me think of one of my favourite song lyrics, or rather, a fragment from one of them, "You've got five long fingers, pointing back at yooouuu!!!!, from the old Dire Straits tune, "Solid Rock".

As for the validity of that tactic, well, depends on how accurate the person doing the pointing is.

If it's just pointing back to retaliate, may I suggest an up-right middle finger raised in their general direction before walking away from them????:1orglaugh

But, of course, best to be careful and know the person with whom you're dealing before trying that one, eh???

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Originally Posted by Donald Rilea

The fingers pointing back at you imagery makes me think of one of my favourite song lyrics, or rather, a fragment from one of them, "You've got five long fingers, pointing back at yooouuu!!!!, from the old Dire Straits tune, "Solid Rock".

As for the validity of that tactic, well, depends on how accurate the person doing the pointing is.

If it's just pointing back to retaliate, may I suggest an up-right middle finger raised in their general direction before walking away from them????:1orglaugh

But, of course, best to be careful and know the person with whom you're dealing before trying that one, eh???

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It's never a valid tactic. It's just an annoyance. You have to keep in mind how many clowns they pack in those clown cars. That's a lot of fingers pointing back. It's nothing to fret over, but it is kind of silly when you actually see the people.

JT

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Originally Posted by Jackie T.

It's never a valid tactic. It's just an annoyance. You have to keep in mind how many clowns they pack in those clown cars. That's a lot of fingers pointing back. It's nothing to fret over, but it is kind of silly when you actually see the people.

JT

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True enough.

ive just had a good read of what u all said, and i think u all must be saints when it comes to dealin with loons or the MoFo-in law, im very blunt and to the point and find when a loons chattin shit bought anything i have one of two responses, i do my very best happy gilmore style piss take out of anything there sayin( the bit when shooter tells him he eats pieces of shit like him for breakfast, his response is u eat shit for breakfast, lol) this just insenses the loon further to go to even greater hieghts of stupidity and somewhere along the way they realise how stupid there bein or simply explode coz its to much for them to take, i know it seem like ur sinkin to there level but as u guys have seen u cant beat them wit common sense so the old u cant beat them, u cant beat them wit a big ass whoopin stick either so join em does have hrs of fun if u have the time.
The second way is whole heartedly agree with everything they say, they get so caught of balance they shut up Lmao!
As for In-laws, argh! They all come from another world were there specialy trained to be the most annoyin wastes of flesh ull ever have the misfortune to meet, sorry for the good ones out there, but there few and far between and obviously escaped before there training was complete lol, ive had some really aweful ones over the yrs, one supported a different football team to me, the house was a shrine to there club, i knocked on the door to pick up the missus in the peein down rain, her dad took one look at the scarf i was wearin and left me outside coz he was a united fan, and im a liverpool fan, took 2 months before i was let in the house. My last in-law was plain mad, she thought someone was tryin to breakin and phoned me and my missus, we live 30mins away, and sounded very scared, i jumped into some clothes and was away down the road as quick as i could, no i dont drive, about 20 mins later, lung burnin, i got to her house she told me what happened and i went round the back checked everywere checked upstairs, only to walk into the kitchen to see her son sat there, hes 20 n capable of lookin after himself, i asked had he just got here very puzzled, he said no ive been her all day, i nearly exploded! lol after a very short conversation wit him bout y was i here if u r? i made it clear what i thought of him and how much i was unimpressed at bein dragged accross town late at night, they just didnt get it and i left in a cloud of colourful murmourins, when i got home my missus gave me grief coz her mum had phoned sayin id shouted at her, eventually when i told her bout her bro bein there all along she was just as puzzled as me lol. In-laws or gfs folks are really hard work some days, its bad enough wit ur own family most days let alone someone elses lol.
But whatever u do dont ask the question, can it get any worse?, bought loons or in-laws, coz the answer always is Definetly! Dont let em take u alive! stay frosty lol

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Originally Posted by Donald Rilea

The fingers pointing back at you imagery makes me think of one of my favourite song lyrics, or rather, a fragment from one of them, "You've got five long fingers, pointing back at yooouuu!!!!, from the old Dire Straits tune, "Solid Rock".

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i was thinkin of a good ol' finn brothers classic, "the finger of blame has turned upon itself". hmm.

and remember kiddies: never argue with an idiot. theyll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

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Originally Posted by evilstonermonkey

i was thinkin of a good ol' finn brothers classic, "the finger of blame has turned upon itself". hmm.

and remember kiddies: never argue with an idiot. theyll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

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Another quote along similar lines: "You've won nothing, if you've bested a fool."-Glenn Campbell as Texas Ranger LaBoeuf in the 1969 Western flick, True Grit.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

What do you do when there are things you really wish you could make someone else understand . . . when you know that (a) there is probably no getting anything through their thick head and (b) it wouldn't really make a difference if you did communicate successfully to them? I find it so difficult not to try to educate people when they are being unreasonable, even though any interaction at all with unreasonable people usually just makes them more unpleasantly unreasonable and not more rational.

Do you go ahead and communicate with (really at) irrational and unreasonable people?

Do you write down your thoughts and not send them or speak to the person?

Or do you just put it out of mind?

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OK, what did I do THIS time?

i just put it out of my mind and move on nowadays, i used to try to talk with them till i was blue in the face but most of them think i have some kind of persecution complex or that im being selfish or unreasonable and it just makes things worse. oh! and i definately don leave notesunder their pillow to read and get fumed about wen im not there

I brood. I give it a time, a day or a couple of days, where I collect my thoughts and organize my arguments, where I sit in front of a word processor and actually try to apply a little poetry to what I want to say. While people seldom react to sense, they often react to beauty - it's an instinctual thing, to slide towards the thoughts that are expressed best. I've won more debates with alliteration than logic.

If you really can't get through to them it's best to just give up - you can't make anyone understand you if they don't want to. People that won't accept ideas that aren't their own usually aren't likely to become any more rational over time.

If it really bothers you then try writing them a letter. Just don't send it to them. A friend of mine with anxiety problems does that all the time, just writes letters to people when they frustrate her or make her upset and doesn't send them. Afterwards she'll either rip them up or put them in her journal - regardless of what she does with the letter after writing it she always feels better just being able to fully express her opinion without contradiction.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

when you know that (a) there is probably no getting anything through their thick head...

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you know what they did to Frances Farmer, to keep her quiet?
there you go.

...

i know what it's like. i've been trying to get through to someone for about fifteen years, and only in the past six months have i made any progress. it's a bit like nethack - every time you learn something, you get a bit closer.

--
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g9...love_you_f.jpg

I tend to not put too many of my thoughts on paper, since it would be evidence for the Prosecution. And the few times when I've been really angry on the net about something, I've got in DEEP trouble!

some people you should just hate and put out of mind

As I mull over New Year's resolutions, I can't help contemplating sending all of these.

There was once a point in my life when I war real suicidal. I have alot of unsent letters I wrote during that period.

Some things have came up since then and have been talked about, others haven't but I learned to not let those things get to me. Some of those people I haven't talked to in the longest time and probably never again will.

I did make a phone call and apologize to someone for something. That was a huge load off my chest. Although it still lingers some. I kind of wish I would bump into her somewhere and we could talk like we used to.

On a lighter note, I sent the following note to the SciFi channel on Sunday regarding their Twilight Zone marathon:

Greetings,

As you may be aware, tomorrow (Monday, 12/31), the Sci Fi channel is showing a Twilight Zone marathon. This vexes me greatly.

Show marathons in general tend to be tedious, being as they're often of a failed series with some variation on this basic plot: Disguised aliens try to take over the earth, while an ardent group of fugitive true believers tries to stop them.

However, when it comes to the Twilight Zone, marathons reach a new level of ridiculous. While indisputably one of the great shows from back in the day, the original series concluded 43 years ago. It's so old it's all in black and white. Even the Andy Griffith show ended later.

Virtually every sci fi fan has seen just about every episode multiple times. The show is referenced in popular culture almost as often as Monty Python (which should NOT be taken as another marathon idea.) It's been done to death.

Anyone who's really gung ho about Twilight Zone owns a box set or two, and has no need of these marathons that keep popping up year after year. This is doubly true since the original episodes are of uneven quality, and most people have but a handful of favorites.

I'd honestly far rather you play a series of B, C, or D grade movies back to back. No clever theme (sharks, zombies, etc.), just a series of unconnected fantasy and sci fi films in sequence. Bring it. Show us what craptastic wonders lie locked away in the Sci Fi Channel vaults.

However, to be perfectly clear, yet more Serling is but poop in my ganache.

Dearly,

--Inox

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Originally Posted by inox

On a lighter note, I sent the following note to the SciFi channel on Sunday regarding their Twilight Zone marathon:

Greetings,

As you may be aware, tomorrow (Monday, 12/31), the Sci Fi channel is showing a Twilight Zone marathon. This vexes me greatly.

Show marathons in general tend to be tedious, being as they're often of a failed series with some variation on this basic plot: Disguised aliens try to take over the earth, while an ardent group of fugitive true believers tries to stop them.

However, when it comes to the Twilight Zone, marathons reach a new level of ridiculous. While indisputably one of the great shows from back in the day, the original series concluded 43 years ago. It's so old it's all in black and white. Even the Andy Griffith show ended later.

Virtually every sci fi fan has seen just about every episode multiple times. The show is referenced in popular culture almost as often as Monty Python (which should NOT be taken as another marathon idea.) It's been done to death.

Anyone who's really gung ho about Twilight Zone owns a box set or two, and has no need of these marathons that keep popping up year after year. This is doubly true since the original episodes are of uneven quality, and most people have but a handful of favorites.

I'd honestly far rather you play a series of B, C, or D grade movies back to back. No clever theme (sharks, zombies, etc.), just a series of unconnected fantasy and sci fi films in sequence. Bring it. Show us what craptastic wonders lie locked away in the Sci Fi Channel vaults.

However, to be perfectly clear, yet more Serling is but poop in my ganache.

Dearly,

--Inox

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If they start running Monty Python marathons, I will write a note addressed to you which holds you responsible, but I won't send it ;)

Actually, I've been watching all my SF on BBC lately -- mostly Torchwood and Life on Mars. Some Dr. Who. I'm guessing I won't be that into the upcoming SciFi Channel incarnation of Dr. Who.

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

If they start running Monty Python marathons, I will write a note addressed to you which holds you responsible, but I won't send it ;)

Actually, I've been watching all my SF on BBC lately -- mostly Torchwood and Life on Mars. Some Dr. Who. I'm guessing I won't be that into the upcoming SciFi Channel incarnation of Dr. Who.

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I'm looking forward to Torchwood (has anyone else noticed that TORCHWOOD spells out DOCTOR WHO?), not so much the new series of Doctor Who, what with Catherine Tate playing the new assistant. I hat to say it, but bring back Kylie Minogue! (If you didn't see the Christmas special, she helps the Doctor save the World)

If Sci Fi start showing Monty Python marathons, I'll be very happy, but since the US Sci-Fi Channel is different to the UK Sci-Fi Channel, (in scheduling, anyway) I won't see what you see.

I'm working on my New Years resolutions and sometimes the more things change, the more they stay the same. :1orglaugh

I usually tell someone that knows them mutually and then we just talk shit for a lil' bit and then I just ignore it. I'm not going to waste my time when someone thinks they are sooo high and mighty and it's just a waste of energy on my part... Sometimes it's nice to write it so that you have proof of that persons stupidity for the future, like in a journal..that you can come back and read and realize that person is still the same.

Communicating rationally with people is a very optimistic expectation at the best of times; I generally like to create a balance between informative and entertaining content, so that even if no one is going to benefit from the solving of any actual problems I'll have enjoyed the process itself.

That is to say; the dumber someone is being, the more I'll sebtext my points with mockery and taunts. Doesn't always apply the other way around though; sometimes I'm just in a sadistic mood, or verbal stabbing contests become my default mode of communication with someone similarly inclined to them.

Thankfully I haven't been in this situation since I left my ex.
Talk about unreasonable people. We had the same argument every weekend for about 8 years. It was so damned frustrating and at times I thought maybe it was me who was being unreasonable. Thank god I snapped out of that. Anyway, yes, I did write him numerous letters but I still don't think he understood what I was trying to say. We could never just have a normal argument b/c he would just argue in circles and nothing ever got resolved.

I just write a song.....leave around the house and hope she sees it....

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Originally Posted by Amelia G

What do you do when there are things you really wish you could make someone else understand . . . when you know that (a) there is probably no getting anything through their thick head and (b) it wouldn't really make a difference if you did communicate successfully to them? I find it so difficult not to try to educate people when they are being unreasonable, even though any interaction at all with unreasonable people usually just makes them more unpleasantly unreasonable and not more rational.

Do you go ahead and communicate with (really at) irrational and unreasonable people?

Do you write down your thoughts and not send them or speak to the person?

Or do you just put it out of mind?

---

i just forget about it. there's no point in wasting my time trying to communicate a thought/emotion to someone who won't listen. it will never get through their thick skulls. the funny thing is that i'm usually the one being called irrational. but which is really less rational - trying to find a common ground or refusing to even talk about it with no other reasoning that "i don't wanna?"
yeah. people are fucks.
but sometimes i just blog it if i'm upset enough by it. "FUCK YOU, MOTHERFUCKER I HATE YOU." :3
*nostalgia for teenage angst*

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Originally Posted by mystoo

Thankfully I haven't been in this situation since I left my ex.
Talk about unreasonable people. We had the same argument every weekend for about 8 years. It was so damned frustrating and at times I thought maybe it was me who was being unreasonable. Thank god I snapped out of that. Anyway, yes, I did write him numerous letters but I still don't think he understood what I was trying to say. We could never just have a normal argument b/c he would just argue in circles and nothing ever got resolved.

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reminds me of me and my ex... we both have such hot tempers... he actually went to counseling for his anger problem. he's my ty, my best friend in the whole wide world.
but after about the first year of happy fuzzy i'm in love stuff, we'd have these HORRENDOUS fights. he would grab me so i couldn't walk away from it, we'd shout, i'd throw stuff (not at him) which would escalate things... i'd end up in tears. and god knows what we'd fight about, i just knew he wasn't listening to me, so i had to get loud and violent. >.> finally we'd had enough and resolved not to fight like that. it got better, just like that. amazing what can be done with a bit of effort.

Effort ya. Only works if both people make the effort. There's only so much shit a person can do sometimes. Then insanity sets in. Glad it worked out for you though:)

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Originally Posted by Raza

Communicating rationally with people is a very optimistic expectation at the best of times; I generally like to create a balance between informative and entertaining content, so that even if no one is going to benefit from the solving of any actual problems I'll have enjoyed the process itself.

That is to say; the dumber someone is being, the more I'll sebtext my points with mockery and taunts. Doesn't always apply the other way around though; sometimes I'm just in a sadistic mood, or verbal stabbing contests become my default mode of communication with someone similarly inclined to them.

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I used to have a friend who believed that, in all altercations, you won if you either convinced the other person or made them too angry to speak coherently. He was pretty entertained by infuriating others.