Leaving Teenage Girls with Ephebophile R Kelly is the Real Crime

[Bikerpunk]

If there's any doubt that justice has been replaced by a crack whore who'll open her legs for a sufficient sized wad, this has dispelled it completely.

Let's see, video evidence, photographic evidence, his own brother saying he tried to bribe him into taking the rap for his actions......

and he fucking walks.

[SyntheticShock]

Thats ridiculous, just cause he's a celebrity. I hate when celebs get treated differently when they break the law in any manner and then act as if it never happened, going on with their careers. If it was some random guy in a club who happened to do the same acts as he had with a minor, he'd be in jail for at least 10 years!

Just like if it was someone other than Paris Hilton or Mel Gibson getting a DUI, and just like if it was someone other than Vince Neil drunk driving, getting into an accident and killing a passenger. Celebrities who go to rehab instead of prison. Its all pretty much slaps on the wrist for some of them.

[Head Wreck]

should see it here, a celeb does stupid amounts of coke, they dont even bother photoshoping the dust arounds nose, is caught on film smoking crack, puts money up to bribe the victim of an assult charge to drop charges..

and nothing happens

[Bikerpunk]

Oh, we love Amy Winehouse. Shush.

But Amy Winehouse never pissed on a boy's neck and statutorily ***** him.

[The Newswire]

Yesterday, R. Kelly was acquitted of charges for child pornography which have been pending for nearly six years now. If I believed he were innocent, I would think it was a real travesty to have such horrible accusations hanging over his head for so long. Now, the extremely witty Josh Levin over at Slate and the highly respected Bill Wyman over at

Read the full article

[Amelia G]

Oh, we love Amy Winehouse. Shush.

But Amy Winehouse never pissed on a boy's neck and statutorily ***** him.

Well, are you sure? Maybe she just never made a video of it.

[OrganizedKhaos]

Until the last hundred yrs or so... underage .... partaking of... was accepted.

I was never attracted to older men until at least my 30's ....

(not incl underage for the record)

BUT.. my bestfriend from HS... was attracted to older men from the age of 14...

I'm not taking a stance ....

except that girls who are violated by older men, is wrong, but some girls can be concentual at that age...

Maybe this has a bit to do with where I was raised....

I'm NOT going to deny that possibility...
HOWever just like any kink, it varies with each person, I do support not violating anyone regardless of age.

[a_small_death]

I call shenanigans!!!

[Bikerpunk]

I am going to deny that possibility - no matter how mature you think you are at 14, you have no business fucking a 40something year old man.

[OrganizedKhaos]

ALL I can say is she rawked his world ..........for real and she didnt have any of those creepy vibes afterward

[Amelia G]

ALL I can say is she rawked his world ..........for real and she didnt have any of those creepy vibes afterward

I think sometimes people underestimate the personhood of those under a certain age. Having finished high school and gone off to college at age 16, I remember being constantly frustrated by stuff I was not allowed to do because of my age.

It is probably necessary to have laws to keep people from doing bad things to one another, but laws based on average maturity and average tastes are going to be inherently flawed. Not sure I have a better solution, but I see the problem.

I mean, I know that, at age fourteen, I was more than capable of saying "no thanks" to anything I did not want to do sexually. Then again, my parents were not deliberately dropping me off at the recording studio of the local wealthy ephebophile,

[OrganizedKhaos]

Thats why getting emancipated is allowed... right?

[OrganizedKhaos]

Oh. and I'm proud of your accomplishments, I cant tell you're above average intelligence... by the way you write, and you're take on things PLUS the questions you think up!!!


(I swear I'm sincere, and not kissing up)

[Bikerpunk]

You cannot convince me that it's a good idea to let 12-14 year olds fuck older men.

I realise that we underestimate often what little girls are capable of

but same girls also often OVERestimate, because "they're so mature, worldly, etc" what they are TRULY capable of and what they can handle and what they can't.

The girl that lives here is 11, a couple of years shy of that number. I don't forsee her becoming an adult in that two years, nor should she. It would rob her of something to get involved in things that have adult feelings and consequences.

What if, OK, your friend, who "rocked his world" had become pregnant at that 14? Gotten herpes and found her ability to have the usual sex with the usual guys her age at that age severely curtailed cause nobody quite wants her anymore? Was she thinking about these or how grown up she was acting?

Alanis Morrissette has a song about how when she was in her young teens she fucked all these older men and at the time felt mature and could handle it, not creepy etc. but then realises now she was being passed around for her youthful looks, and there was a LOT that it robbed her of, and of herself, that she didn;'t realise then.

[mystoo]

But aren't we all a bunch of know-it-alls when we're young?

[Amelia G]

You cannot convince me that it's a good idea to let 12-14 year olds fuck older men.

I realise that we underestimate often what little girls are capable of

but same girls also often OVERestimate, because "they're so mature, worldly, etc" what they are TRULY capable of and what they can handle and what they can't.

The girl that lives here is 11, a couple of years shy of that number. I don't forsee her becoming an adult in that two years, nor should she. It would rob her of something to get involved in things that have adult feelings and consequences.

What if, OK, your friend, who "rocked his world" had become pregnant at that 14? Gotten herpes and found her ability to have the usual sex with the usual guys her age at that age severely curtailed cause nobody quite wants her anymore? Was she thinking about these or how grown up she was acting?

Alanis Morrissette has a song about how when she was in her young teens she fucked all these older men and at the time felt mature and could handle it, not creepy etc. but then realises now she was being passed around for her youthful looks, and there was a LOT that it robbed her of, and of herself, that she didn;'t realise then.

When I was fourteen, I caused a huge scandal by dating the twenty-one-year-old older brother of one of my friends. I was definitely not a victim there. I pursued him aggressively. Although I no longer even recall how he spelled his name today, some place, packed away in a box, I probably still have the long letters he wrote me about how he absolutely could not make himself into more of a black sheep than he already was by dating me. I'm pretty good at making things happen, once I set my mind to them, so he eventually gave in. He was very bright, but he did still live at home and play D&D with his little sister's teenage friends, so he probably really wasn't particularly more developed than I was.

When I turned twenty-one myself, although I'd thought the scandal was stupid when I was fourteen, I found it bizarre that someone who was twenty-one could have been into a fourteen-year-old. I surely did not find ninth graders hot after I'd already been out of college for some time. But, at that age, I wasn't into the older dudes who wanted to give me research fellowships or apartments in return for a sexual relationship either.

I did not give a fuck what the rules were at either of those times. I felt like rules should not apply to my personal life. And yet, I still ended up doing mostly pretty age-appropriate things.

In most cases, one would expect the older person to show some restraint. In the case of someone like R. Kelly who is clearly mentally deficient, one would hope and expect that the responsible adults around a teenage girl would not be pimping her out in hopes of future extortion.

That said, the central girl (now twenty-three-years-old) in the R. Kelly video case said she did not wish to testify against him and that, if compelled to do so, she would deny it was her in the video.

I think it may be debatable what the age of consent should be. I do think there is a huge difference between ephebophilia and **********, but I do not think there is any gray area in terms of what the adults in the R. Kelly case did. A bunch of people apparently did everything within their power to both pimp out young teenage girls and to take advantage of a mentally handicapped adult. I'm not sure what the term for their crimes should be, but I really do think they are the real criminals in this situation.

[Bikerpunk]

I did not give a fuck what the rules were at either of those times.

One reason why a bit of a wait to have sex would be in order - for the VAST majority of people at that age.

I found it bizarre that someone who was twenty-one could have been into a fourteen-year-old. I surely did not find ninth graders hot after I'd already been out of college for some time.

BINGO. What kind of man wants to have sex with a kid? One who probably shouldn't be - and one who's enough of a loser at life to not succeed with an adult woman. Someone who truly likes the relationship involved to be unequal.

I dunno what an ephebophile is, so I'll just use its appropriate approximation: "diddler".

[Amelia G]

One reason why a bit of a wait to have sex would be in order - for the VAST majority of people at that age.



BINGO. What kind of man wants to have sex with a kid? One who probably shouldn't be - and one who's enough of a loser at life to not succeed with an adult woman. Someone who truly likes the relationship involved to be unequal.

I dunno what an ephebophile is, so I'll just use its appropriate approximation: "diddler".

I'm pretty sure diddler means something else.

Read the article for the definition of ephebophilia

[Bikerpunk]

Okay, I stand corrected. A kiddy diddler is someone who has sex with a child.
An ephebophile is someone who has sex with someone who ALMOST isn't a child.

Either one's gonna be force fed his own severed dick if I find out who one is.

[Rockwulf]

This chick I work with is obsessed with R. Kelly. She put out a my space bulletin and the following conversation happened:

"To all my freinds famliy and homies as you all should know by now my man r. Kelly is free and he will stay free I will be getting a tatoo with my boo name on it so stay tuned for new photos. Bitchesssss!!!!!!"

" Is it gonna look like those trucker stickers with the kid pissing on the Ford logo?"

"The hell with you Rockwulf!!!!!!"

" Aww c'mon, that shit would be funny! You could put his face on the kid and instead of Ford or Chevy, it could say "Justice""

" As I said before the HELL with you with a cherry on top"

[OrganizedKhaos]

You cannot convince me that it's a good idea to let 12-14 year olds fuck older men.

I realise that we underestimate often what little girls are capable of

but same girls also often OVERestimate, because "they're so mature, worldly, etc" what they are TRULY capable of and what they can handle and what they can't.

The girl that lives here is 11, a couple of years shy of that number. I don't forsee her becoming an adult in that two years, nor should she. It would rob her of something to get involved in things that have adult feelings and consequences.

What if, OK, your friend, who "rocked his world" had become pregnant at that 14? Gotten herpes and found her ability to have the usual sex with the usual guys her age at that age severely curtailed cause nobody quite wants her anymore? Was she thinking about these or how grown up she was acting?

Alanis Morrissette has a song about how when she was in her young teens she fucked all these older men and at the time felt mature and could handle it, not creepy etc. but then realises now she was being passed around for her youthful looks, and there was a LOT that it robbed her of, and of herself, that she didn;'t realise then.

To be honest, my friend didnt catch anything, because she WAS mature enough to prevent such a happening.

She didnt just fuck whoever, and SHE was attracted to older men....

Just because you know a girl at 11 who WOULDNT be up to it does NOT disqualify the ONES who ARE.

I recognize the why's the law is what is is....

I would never try to sway what Your Take on LIFE is...

Thats your responsibility.......ME, I dont think that its all cut and dry, black and white...
I believe there IS a gray area.

[Bikerpunk]

I find it fascinating.

A 12 year old who would let an illiterate in his 30s piss on her neck and then fuck her is not in full control of her faculties as to figuring out what she wants and needs.

[Amelia G]

I find it fascinating.

A 12 year old who would let an illiterate in his 30s piss on her neck and then fuck her is not in full control of her faculties as to figuring out what she wants and needs.

Which is why there should be responsible adults around being responsible.

Also, nobody contends that she was twelve in the video and there is a big difference for girls between age twelve and age fourteen. And it is my understanding that he didn't fuck the girl in the video, although they may have had intercourse on other occasions.

[Amelia G]

This chick I work with is obsessed with R. Kelly. She put out a my space bulletin and the following conversation happened:

"To all my freinds famliy and homies as you all should know by now my man r. Kelly is free and he will stay free I will be getting a tatoo with my boo name on it so stay tuned for new photos. Bitchesssss!!!!!!"

" Is it gonna look like those trucker stickers with the kid pissing on the Ford logo?"

"The hell with you Rockwulf!!!!!!"

" Aww c'mon, that shit would be funny! You could put his face on the kid and instead of Ford or Chevy, it could say "Justice""

" As I said before the HELL with you with a cherry on top"

You should totally be a tattoo designer!

[Bikerpunk]

I dunno man, where there's smoke, there's fire.

I've never understood the non-legal attitude to this sort of thing.

I mean, Amelia has plainly said, her at 14 with someone in his mid 20s = cool.
Her in 20s with someone in his late 30s etc. = creepy old dude.

?

Same age differential, no?

[mystoo]

I once had an affair with a 60 yr. old. I was 31. I really liked him and we got along well...age is a state of mind.

[Bikerpunk]

An affair?

[mystoo]

Ssshhhhhh.....

[One Eyed Cat]

I lost my virginity at 16 to someone in their 20s. I can't say I felt victimized (albeit a bit embarassed with my initial sloppiness) haha. I do view it differently with girls and/or authority figures. I would rather admit that I may have a double standard than pretend I'm subjectively the scales of justice.

OEC

[Amelia G]

I dunno man, where there's smoke, there's fire.

I've never understood the non-legal attitude to this sort of thing.

I mean, Amelia has plainly said, her at 14 with someone in his mid 20s = cool.
Her in 20s with someone in his late 30s etc. = creepy old dude.

?

Same age differential, no?

The age difference between fourteen and twenty-one is seven years.

I didn't check IDs when I was twenty-one, but I would assume 100% of the guys who offered me a life beyond what my years would normally offer were past their thirties. Some of the turn-off to me was that they didn't try to relate with dinner and a movie (at a time in my life when I always went Dutch) but with the sort of gifts that an older man could provide and someone my own age probably could not.

Waaaaaaaaay bigger age differences, but I don't think any of them should be jailed.

[One Eyed Cat]

The age difference between fourteen and twenty-one is seven years.

I didn't check IDs when I was twenty-one, but I would assume 100% of the guys who offered me a life beyond what my years would normally offer were past their thirties. Some of the turn-off to me was that they didn't try to relate with dinner and a movie (at a time in my life when I always went Dutch) but with the sort of gifts that an older man could provide and someone my own age probably could not.

Waaaaaaaaay bigger age differences, but I don't think any of them should be jailed.

20s is fair game for guys considerably older than me.

[DiePlague]

[QUOTE=OrganizedKhaos]To be honest, my friend didnt catch anything, because she WAS mature enough to prevent such a happening.

She didnt just fuck whoever, and SHE was attracted to older men....

Just because you know a girl at 11 who WOULDNT be up to it does NOT disqualify the ONES who ARE...."



thats exactly the point! there may be ( and i doubt it) 11, 13, 14 year old girls who are totally mature and would "be up to" being pissed and fucked by older men, but the fact there are (and its the vaaaaaaaaast majority) 11, 13, and 15 year old girls who couldnt possibly ever have enough knowledge and maturity to make such decision it makes perfectly reasonable that the legal age for consensual would set up at 18 or 16 depending on the country, because its not to protect the ones who can make the decition but the ones who cant.