What are your thoughts on the Critical Mass bike protests?

[ForrestBlack]

A couple videos have been making the rounds and there is a group that regularly rides the streets in my neighborhood. Are they effective? Reasonable? Within their rights? Are they communicating their message or just looking for trouble? Warriors for global change or crybaby emo thugs?

[Morning Glory]

wel I think I made my thoughts on the subject pretty clear in the bike thread...

but to answer your questions:

-yes

-no (and that's kinda the point)

-no (I don't think they care)

-I'm note sure they are doing either.

-could be both. I think that it's a bit rash to make such a generalization about thier personalities and motivations.

[Kidthorazine]

Yeah, I keep a soft air gun with me when Im riding with my step-bro in case some biker asshats decide to block traffic in the park by taking up the entire street, I kind of agree with them, but that kind of shit just pisses people off and makes people not like them

[One Eyed Cat]

Critical Mass is effective only in the sense that they make an immediate point. They may convert an extremely marginal amount of people away from driving. I don't know. Overall though, it is implausible that they have really made a difference in the level of air pollution. That comes from consensus building and higher emission standards.

It's Direct Action. Their point is to be unreasonable. They generally are outside their legal rights. It really would just come down to the amount of complaints and who got caught that particular ride.

They just evoke emotion. I don't know that they have a cohesive message. It's just kinda "This is all wrong. Stop driving!"

They are for global change merely by evoking (emo)tion. They want global change, but that particular form of direct action is not gonna do it. You want to construct bicycle friendly cities and help folks learn the joys of a nice ride. I see the Portland model as what works. You can actually "borrow" bikes at certain points in the city then drop them off at others. There has been a surprisingly low amount of theft. I prefer to live in these types of cities, but I do not see this happening as a result of Critical Mass. It comes more from political action and simply people who want to live in what might be called a "green city".

They are fairly emo to take up the cause in LA (I'd say the same for a good part of the Bay Area.) Idling cars there will just piss people off. My sense is it may even cause more air pollution. It's really just a "Fuck You".

When I lived in the Bay Area, I knew a few. They all came from a certain scene we've spoken of previously. I remember driving one down to a show. It was completely implausible for me not to own a car there. I had responsibilities (and interests) that took me all across the Bay, to Sonoma County, and Solano County. They really just pissed me off. I drove a damn Festiva too.

I do intend to get a bike in MN. This is due to Minneapolis being a very progressive city conducive to bike riders. I doubt Critical Mass had anything to do with it (although I don't doubt some narcissists amongst em telling me its why I get to ride)

OEC

[Toe Cutter]

I kind of agree with them, but that kind of shit just pisses people off and makes people not like them

My thoughts exactly.

It's totally rude, I also think it speaks loudly of egocentricity and an immature mind.

"look at us, we're on bikes and we're stopping traffic to piss people in cars off. How witty and clever we are"

[Morning Glory]

it speaks loudly of egocentricity and an immature mind.

as opposed to fifty million people bumper to bumper inching thier way to the office every morning?

car culture is absurd, not only is it horrible for the environment, encourages people to be lazy and dependent and actually discourages the cause of transporation by just making people drive increasing distances and commute to the city where all the traffic meets at a bottleneck instead of thinking about ways for people to travel more effective and efficiently in a given area, it's recklessly dangerous and one of the most unsafe things you can do.

so considering that you are getting pissed off at the thought of having any hinderance on your driving, which one is really the stubborn asshole about what they are doing?

both. but cars still suck.

[Kidthorazine]

I'm seriously waiting for there to be some problem where an ambulance or something has to get through a bunch of bikers doing one of these things, or gets stuck in traffic because of one and somebody dies.

[Toe Cutter]

so considering that you are getting pissed off at the thought of having any hinderance on your driving, which one is really the stubborn asshole about what they are doing?

You calling me an asshole?
Yeah, let's blame people who are trying to get to work and make a living (Like you know anything about that). There are so many options & alternatives for people. Those critical mass cunts are really helping fix the problem.

[One Eyed Cat]

as opposed to fifty million people bumper to bumper inching thier way to the office every morning?

car culture is absurd, not only is it horrible for the environment, encourages people to be lazy and dependent and actually discourages the cause of transporation by just making people drive increasing distances and commute to the city where all the traffic meets at a bottleneck instead of thinking about ways for people to travel more effective and efficiently in a given area, it's recklessly dangerous and one of the most unsafe things you can do.

so considering that you are getting pissed off at the thought of having any hinderance on your driving, which one is really the stubborn asshole about what they are doing?

Practically speaking, you have to drive in some places. I arranged my move carefully so I could get around without a car most of the time. Even in a progressive city, folks have to work though. It takes a lot more than a bunch of kids blocking traffic to change things. I make no apologies for driving. If I were to do so, I would first apologize for driving kids who were involved (or sympathized with) C.M. to the Gilman when a band I liked showed up.



both. but cars still suck.

Practically speaking, you have to drive in some places. I arranged my move carefully so I could get around without a car most of the time. Even in a progressive city, folks have to work though. It takes a lot more than a bunch of kids blocking traffic to change things. I make no apologies for driving. If I were to do so, I would first apologize for driving kids who were involved (or sympathized with) C.M. down to the Gilman when a band I liked showed up. We need more city planning and consensus building, that's the only way it can work.

OEC

[Mr Karl]

don't know what your talking about

[Morning Glory]

I'm not calling anyone an asshole, I'm stating what to me makes an asshole- if people wish to align themselves with that definition, then it's not my problem. just like some consider assholes to be people that spend one day riding thier bikes and having fun and force people to deal with it because the other 364 days they are forced to have to work and people in cars are taking up all the roads and forcing them off.

I really don't give a shit if someone hampering your ability to lead a destructive lifestyle hurts your feelings. If some yuppie wants to get out of thier SUV with the "more blood for oil" sticker on the back and start shit with me about my bike being on the road than we'll see how they like it wrapped around thier ears instead.

[Morning Glory]

ps. just to make things perfectly clear I DO have a job and I ride in a car from time to time and less frequently but on occasion drive a car. I'm not saying that there's never any need or that it's practical to give up these things 100%. What I'm NOT doing is defending and justifying them as being right and accusing bicyclists or anyone esle that takes steps to be more social conscious and eco freindly as the problem, because they aren't. I admit that I am part of the problem, but I try to the best of my abilties to help that. I respect anyone who does that. I don't respect people that know that nd refuse to acknowledge it and refuse to try and change and especially critisize those that are doing something about it at the same time.

[Morning Glory]

eh. I don't know why i'm getting pissed off about this. fuck it. do you really like sitting in traffic jams and going to work that much? you gotta live a little once in a while and just do something immature and stupid and fun as hell. we're not too old yet.

[Buster Friendly]

hey toecutter, i'm calling you an asshole.

fuck drivers.

i used to ride my fucking bike on the fucking shoulder of the road, not even on the road itself, and about once a day, some jockofuckface would take his fucking matchbox suv and swerve it in my general direction, which is real fucking funny when you're all nice, and safe inside a huge metal box... not so much if you're exposed in the open on a bike.

i seriously considered carrying my 9mm with me, except i knew i'd end up in jail... every fucking day assholes...

oh yeah, and a mentor of mine got killed riding his bike, by a driver who didn't have the fucking balls to stick around and call him a fucking ambulance. 79 years old, came all the way from china, could kick your honky ass up, down, and sideways... just to die on the side of the road because some redneck thought he was a 'cunt' or a 'gook', or some soccer mom couldn't be bothered to watch what the fuck she was doing while on her fucking cell phone.

fuck you assholes.

these days i don't ride a bike, nyc you can get around without a fucking suv you yuppie twats, and you fucking pussies still try to run us over in the cross walks, AGAINST THE FUCKING LIGHTS. fine you got a green light, and i'm jaywalking, do you best... but obey traffic signals, or shut the fuck up about lawless bikers...

btw... i used to catch up to you little pussies when you were parked in traffic, and terrorize the fuck out of you, if i couldn't drag you through a window... heh. nothing like beating down a fucking shitheel as he's half hanging from the driver's side window... i still punch passing cars when they try to make it through the cross walk. you think they'd slow down for a stroller, wouldn't you?

fuck drivers. fuck drivers, fuck drivers.

get the fuck out of your armored box and try that shit ASSHOLE! fucking twat, fucking cankerous cunt... yeah, i called you an asshole toecutter.

[Toe Cutter]

I'm sensing a little anger. My dad can beat up your dad...

Hey tough guy! Just for your information, this honkey rides a scooter in the summer AND I also live close to work so I don't have to drive. Doing my part, so blow me. A friend of mine got hit on his motorcycle by a car, I know how that feels too. So don't bag on me about some cunt in a suv or a bunch of random other problems you have people who drive cars. I didn't do it, nor do I defend people who drive poorly and irresponsibly.

What I was saying is that not everybody lives in New york and has the option to take public transportation or ride a bike. That's what I meant. Also this thread was about critical mass protests not shitty drivers. Sorry you had such shitty experiences. Don't take it out on me.

Why don't you get some anger management counceling you fucking meat-head.

[Morning Glory]

ok. that's fair TC. that hostility, at least on my part, really wasn't directed at you.

yeah, there are better ways to put it but I think that good deal of the assholeness of the critical masses is in response to those "shitty drivers" that I was chewing out and I stand by my comment that anyone who wants to be one of "them" and go against "us" well they are looking for trouble. But the key word here is them looking, not me trying to find.

BTW, scooters are cool.

[Anarkey]

yup ,,,im stickin too the bus for a few ,glad i cant afford gas ,,, or a car ,

[Buster Friendly]

you're 'senseing some anger'? what the fuck are you some sort of fucking retarded jedi? 'some' anger?

i had to bike 20 miles a day to school, and work, it wasn't some sort of fashion statement, i had to do it, in illinois, in november. motherfuckers tried to kill me. they did kill a mentor of mine.

i won't even go into the long list of my friends who've been injured, or crippled while riding motorcycles.

i moved to nyc, where i wouldn't even bother to ride a bike, the way people drive around here, it just isn't worth it. but on foot, obeying cross walks, and all the shit like that, and the fucking twats STILL try their best to run you over.

i won't pardon the cabbies who learned to fuckin' drive in iraq, fuck them, but at least they have an excuse... but i'd like to call a fucking open season on the fucking suv drivers, because there's no fuckin' way that shit is excusable in a city like new york, and especially on an island like manhattan... we need that parking space for delivery vans, and the fucking thrice damned tour buses.

bicyclist get killed here in new york, and nobody does a fucking thing about it. before Critical Mass, nobody ever talked about it, or even thought about it. now the fucking genius police department wire taps the Critical Mass organizers, and has the under surveillance as 'potential terrorists'...WTF??? the police hassle ANY bicyclist here in nyc, not just the Critical Massholes. ANYONE riding a bike is subject to cop harrassment, at any time.

people have such a fucked up sense of entitlement with their fucking cars in this country. oh, they made you 30 seconds late to get to the next red light? RUN 'EM OVER!! it's your duty as an american. yeah, i guess Critical Mass is worse than hitler because somebody had to wait in their car an extra 5 min. gawddamn...

if folks hadn't been trying to kill me for riding a bike, i might have actually found your, and kidthorzine's 'dittohead' reactions kind of funny, in an ironic 'what a couple of ultramaroons' sort of way.

but see, i'm kind of funny in that way... when people try to kill me, i lose my sense of humor real fast.

so yeah, i'm still calling you an asshole. ultimately effective or not at least Critical Mass is actually doing something, rather than just accepting a situation. (taxing cars into oblivion would be more effective, and generate the revenue necessary to build effective public transportation in places other than new york in this country. fucking retarded that we don't have a viable train system.)

and btw... your dad, and my dad, can team up... with the profession wrestler of your choice, and i'll kick the shit out of all three of them, while whistling 'cat scratch fever' by ted nuggent, because i'm a baaaaaaaad man. no shit.

[Nightingale]

And, of course, since a few people out of hundreds of millions have been proven guilty of intense stupidity and dangerous driving, everyone who drives is guilty ... right?

[xssve]

I'm with Buster - wrap somebody in a ton of metal, it enables all sorts of latent sociopathic behaviors. Unfortunately, bikers can get busted for carrying guns - a wrist rocket works pretty good, but you hafta stop to use it.

Neighbor got run over last week riding to work, broken pelvis.

[badkittyamy]

I don't know I can't ride a bike so sorry guys. but they have every right to drive en masse as long as they are going somewhere in my opinion it' against the law to ride a bike through park in savannah and thy aren't allowed anywhere cars aren't basically so either let them in the road or change the laws. But no I'm not converting to bike riding, what about the handicapped and those who can't ride bikes?

My Lady can NOT ride a bike, she wears a knee brace, she wouldn't make it 1 mile. Hell she can't even drive her husbands car because it's to low and the wheel doesn't adjust. A bike won;t work for everyone and I hate mass protests trying to make people feel bad about common practices like eating meat or driving a car.

[xssve]

And, of course, since a few people out of hundreds of millions have been proven guilty of intense stupidity and dangerous driving, everyone who drives is guilty ... right?

It's more common than you might think over here, I dunno about Germany.

It's basically attempted homicide - and not only is the perpetrator not sorry, they often drive away laughing about it - that this tends to piss person off is an understatement.

[Buster Friendly]

that's what i meant.

it just pisses me off that i have to work overtime to control my homicidal impulses, and these punks think they're beyond reach... or that they have a right to injure, maim, and kill me, and my friends, with no consquences...

it's 'upsetting'.

[Toe Cutter]

you're 'senseing some anger'? what the fuck are you some sort of fucking retarded jedi? 'some' anger?

Good one...

so yeah, i'm still calling you an asshole. ultimately effective or not at least Critical Mass is actually doing something, rather than just accepting a situation.

Yeah, good. I still think your a fucking meat head. Critical mass is doing something but what they are doing is making ordinary people hate them and alienating people who otherwise may have been sympathetic to their plight. Why aren't they fucking with politicians and city council people instead of ordinary people just trying to get on with their life?

(taxing cars into oblivion would be more effective, and generate the revenue necessary to build effective public transportation in places other than new york in this country. fucking retarded that we don't have a viable train system.)

This may be the only thing I agree with you on

and btw... your dad, and my dad, can team up... with the profession wrestler of your choice, and i'll kick the shit out of all three of them, while whistling 'cat scratch fever' by ted nuggent, because i'm a baaaaaaaad man. no shit.

Why don't you spare me your macho bravado. Who cares. So you can beat a lot of peoples asses? Seeing as how you brag about it, I hope it makes you feel like a big man. I'm sure people are really impressed when you describe dragging somebody out of their car and beating them up. Strong work! You sound like you should be in a cage.

[Buster Friendly]

Yeah, good. I still think your a fucking meat head.

--okay, i'm a fucking meathead, and you're a fucking asshole. isn't consensus building fun?

Critical mass is doing something but what they are doing is making ordinary people hate them and alienating people who otherwise may have been sympathetic to their plight. Why aren't they fucking with politicians and city council people instead of ordinary people just trying to get on with their life?

--didn't know the city council was trying to run over bicyclists on a daily basis... what you still don't seem to get is that your fucking beloved ordinary people are the fucking problem since they're the ones that try to commit veichular homicide on the regular. 'ordinary people' are the ones that have have to realize that they don't live in a fucking 'grand theft auto' video game where their actions have no consquences.


Why don't you spare me your macho bravado.

--because it seems to upset you, and you're whining about it is funny.

Who cares.

not too many people apparently. it's highly overrated.

So you can beat a lot of peoples asses? Seeing as how you brag about it,

--it ain't a brag is you can do it.

I hope it makes you feel like a big man.

--nah, you don't. you hope that your whining will make me feel like a small man, and that you'll somehow shame me into shutting the fuck up. how's that working out for you?

I'm sure people are really impressed when you describe dragging somebody out of their car and beating them up.

--no you're not. you're trying to protray my behavior as socially unacceptable, and discredit my position that i have a right to defend myself against violence from mindless assholes who think they are beyond reach through retribution.

Strong work! You sound like you should be in a cage.

---hahaha... i probably should be.

but at least i don't go around displacing my aggression through a large metal box, against the unprotected bodies of other 'ordinary folks' who are just trying to walk, or ride their bikes.

you can get all hung up about precieved 'tough guys' if you want toecutter, but at the end of the day people we care about are still at risk of dying due to the thoughless actions of weaklings in suvs.

[Toe Cutter]

but at the end of the day people we care about are still at risk of dying due to the thoughless actions of weaklings in suvs.

Yes, I understand that, and believe it or not I've almost been t-boned on my scooter by some asshole in a car too. I just refuse to say 'fuck everybody who drives a car' or that 'everybody who drives is guilty of attempted murder' that's total bullshit! That seems to be your argument. From the beginning I've been specifically speaking about the critical mass protestors and their methods. I think they are cunts, is that okay with you? I'm an asshole because I have different opinion then you.

you're trying to protray my behavior as socially unacceptable, and discredit my position that i have a right to defend myself against violence from mindless assholes who think they are beyond reach through retribution.

Yeah right dude. You totally have a right to defend yourself, but in your first post you come off like some unhinged animal pounding your chest about wanting to kill people and shit. That is socially unacceptable and you discredit yourself when you speak like that. You can't see that? You sound crazy!

So you honestly think Critical mass protestors are making a difference for the better? They are the champions for all 2-wheeled commuters? No way! Yes, they may be doing something but what they are doing is futile. Maybe if they protested in a more effective way they would put in bike lanes like they did here, or perhaps other more efficient mass transit or whatever...

[One Eyed Cat]

'ordinary people' are the ones that have have to realize that they don't live in a fucking 'grand theft auto' video game where their actions have no consquences.

<flames omitted>

but at the end of the day people we care about are still at risk of dying due to the thoughless actions of weaklings in suvs.

I hear ya when u just state the facts Buster. My cousin was hit-and-run in a crosswalk last summer. He went apeshit mad from the head trauma. He disappeared for weeks and we all were starting to assume the worst. He is still alive. I don't know what the future holds.

You find me that driver? I'll stomp him. I'm no bad-ass that can do the shit u talk about, but I'll stomp him in a mad fit of adrenaline. You can play whatever tune u want. I'll stomp him to the Mickey Mouse Song. You show me these people who killed your friends and I won't blink as you bash their skulls in to Bobby McFarrin.

My Cousin's Good Friend: She was killed in SF in another hit-and-run. I don't like the status quo anymore than you do Buster. I'm also completely fucking cognizant of all this when I have to drive.

These are appeals to emotion though. We need solutions. It doesn't change the stone cold realities of society as it stands. I worked/played in a 100 mile radius, I have arthritis in my knee and no decent public transport. Gotta put food on the table.

I have no love lost on "the people", but the system would have to change. You aren't gonna be able stomp it out of existence. Will it change? Is it possible? I don't know. We live within it whether we like it or not. People can ride their bikes in traffic. I may read about some NYC driver getting smashed by you or someone else. That won't do it. I don't have the answers. I can offer a few suggestions, but they aren't gonna make the shit you detest disappear. Focus your anger. Get shit done. Tell me what it is and why it will work. Then things start to change.

OEC

[Toe Cutter]

and btw... your dad, and my dad, can team up... with the profession wrestler of your choice, and i'll kick the shit out of all three of them, while whistling 'cat scratch fever' by ted nuggent, because i'm a baaaaaaaad man. no shit.

and by the way, the Undertaker would totally kill you!

[Buster Friendly]

From the beginning I've been specifically speaking about the critical mass protestors and their methods. I think they are cunts, is that okay with you? I'm an asshole because I have different opinion then you.
.

yeah, see that's why i'm calling you an asshole.

"I think they are cunts"-they have a different opinion and medothology than you, and you think they are "cunts".

since we still have the right of free speech, and assembly in this country, (at least on paper, and so far as i am aware this week) they have the prefect right to get together and ride.

when cars do this we just call it "rush hour".

and btw i don't make excuses for being a violent person, but you'll never catch me doing anything illegal. i never break laws, no matter what i may have done in the past. hey, i just went for a walk in the park, and guess what? i didn't injure or maim a single person... no matter how badly they were asking for it. (little bastards riding along in their strollers... smug toddlers... i'd beat them into a red slimey paste.)

you can have the last word about my being a meathead, or a crazy person or whatever, i'll stick to Critical Mass (for the most part) for the rest of the thread.

say what you want about Critical Mass' methods, they have sparked the discussion, and this IS a problem.

(car driving. big problem.)

[Buster Friendly]

and by the way, the Undertaker would totally kill you!

dude, not to totally be silly, but not really.

fighting's really no big deal.

i have a certain amount of respect for professional wrestlers, and professional athletes of any stripe, but it's pointless.

actually it did feel good to be able to fend off pickpockets in rome for my half blind father (he walks with a cane) but that's about the only time in recent memory. mostly it's a drag, and a hassle.

you can have the last word again if you want

[Toe Cutter]

Okay, I see what your saying. I'm an asshole. Agree to disagree. That's fair.



I was just teasing you about the Undertaker.

[Buster Friendly]

You find me that driver? I'll stomp him. I'm no bad-ass that can do the shit u talk about, but I'll stomp him in a mad fit of adrenaline. You can play whatever tune u want. I'll stomp him to the Mickey Mouse Song. You show me these people who killed your friends and I won't blink as you bash their skulls in to Bobby McFarrin

OEC

now THAT i'd pay to see... (and i'm sorry this happened to your cousin.) i have a warped perspective, and wasted way too much time on learning how to hit shit when i was young. *shrug*

again i think the main value o f Critical Mass is that they draw attention to the situation, and point out that "hey, we have a legal right to ride, and be safe, and that's not happening, drivers are killing bicyclists, and pedestrians!"

it's a shame that we live in an economy where people are more or less forced to drive cars. i lived in california for about a year, and tried walking, and biking it.... it sucked ass, the buses in san diego suck moose balls. i could walk to work int he the time it took me to catch the bus.

the whole gas/car/oil economy thing is one the things that's going to seriously fuck up our country in the next few years... it's bad news.

bikes are one VERY sensible alternative. obviously not for everybody, but for a hell of alot of the folks out there commuting by bike would do them a world of good.

in every other industrialized nation they have light rail... 100 miles? you can go just about anywhere in the EU by train... in japan trains are a way of life... not perfect, but much more economical than private individually owned cars.

as another aside i LOVE driving, when i own cars. but it's too much of a pain in the ass to deal with. gas insurance, parking.... fuck all of that. i love riding my bike alot more, and i can't do that because of asshole drivers trying to kill me. didn't seem that way when i was a kid, but then again i didn't have cops trying to ticket me for riding onthe side walk when i was like 11 either.

[VoltaireBlue]

I ride with CM every month here. I've ridden with CM off and on for the last ten years. There are assholes in every "scene"(if you want to call it that)... I do it just beacuse it's fun to ride in a group, and have always met cool folks on rides.

[One Eyed Cat]

now THAT i'd pay to see... (and i'm sorry this happened to your cousin.) i have a warped perspective, and wasted way too much time on learning how to hit shit when i was young. *shrug*

again i think the main value o f Critical Mass is that they draw attention to the situation, and point out that "hey, we have a legal right to ride, and be safe, and that's not happening, drivers are killing bicyclists, and pedestrians!"

it's a shame that we live in an economy where people are more or less forced to drive cars. i lived in california for about a year, and tried walking, and biking it.... it sucked ass, the buses in san diego suck moose balls. i could walk to work int he the time it took me to catch the bus.

the whole gas/car/oil economy thing is one the things that's going to seriously fuck up our country in the next few years... it's bad news.

bikes are one VERY sensible alternative. obviously not for everybody, but for a hell of alot of the folks out there commuting by bike would do them a world of good.

in every other industrialized nation they have light rail... 100 miles? you can go just about anywhere in the EU by train... in japan trains are a way of life... not perfect, but much more economical than private individually owned cars.

as another aside i LOVE driving, when i own cars. but it's too much of a pain in the ass to deal with. gas insurance, parking.... fuck all of that. i love riding my bike alot more, and i can't do that because of asshole drivers trying to kill me. didn't seem that way when i was a kid, but then again i didn't have cops trying to ticket me for riding onthe side walk when i was like 11 either.

hehe I know violence wouldn't ultimately solve it (although it would be damn fun to get that particular turd). I can commute by bicycle, it just has to be within reason. I've ridden up to 20 miles so, it'll be no big deal once in get to MN. I'm undecided on whether to keep the car. I'll probably see how the winter plays out.

California, I believe, passed an initiative to build a light rail system in the '06 election. I don't know the details, it sure would alleviate some gridlock if it worked though.

OEC

[Michelle Aston]

FUCKING -A!

Awesome thread!

My car blew up somewhere 100 miles from in Indy and will a squirmy pitbull and a backpack full of smut wear I managed to make it back home. A year later still no car, and I think I am the only pornstar to hike up to Muholland from Ventura Blvd, before my porn shoot with Hustler for a call time of 8am. ("Over 40 MILF" shot when I was 35. Heh.)

I spent the evening tonight converting a gifted 10 speed from the 80's to a fixed gear at Bicycle Kitchen,
I used to ride on the shoulder, now I ride right down the middle of the street in downtown LA. I ignore the honking and I just laugh at the gas guzzlers spening damn good beer money at the pump. I get everywhere I need to go on bus, and if I can't I get a ride with the crew, or just don't do the gig. No big deal. I just need a tricycle so I don't fall off after Irish Car Bombs.

[Amelia G]

hey toecutter, i'm calling you an asshole.

fuck drivers.

i used to ride my fucking bike on the fucking shoulder of the road, not even on the road itself, and about once a day, some jockofuckface would take his fucking matchbox suv and swerve it in my general direction, which is real fucking funny when you're all nice, and safe inside a huge metal box... not so much if you're exposed in the open on a bike.

i seriously considered carrying my 9mm with me, except i knew i'd end up in jail... every fucking day assholes...

oh yeah, and a mentor of mine got killed riding his bike, by a driver who didn't have the fucking balls to stick around and call him a fucking ambulance. 79 years old, came all the way from china, could kick your honky ass up, down, and sideways... just to die on the side of the road because some redneck thought he was a 'cunt' or a 'gook', or some soccer mom couldn't be bothered to watch what the fuck she was doing while on her fucking cell phone.

fuck you assholes.

these days i don't ride a bike, nyc you can get around without a fucking suv you yuppie twats, and you fucking pussies still try to run us over in the cross walks, AGAINST THE FUCKING LIGHTS. fine you got a green light, and i'm jaywalking, do you best... but obey traffic signals, or shut the fuck up about lawless bikers...

btw... i used to catch up to you little pussies when you were parked in traffic, and terrorize the fuck out of you, if i couldn't drag you through a window... heh. nothing like beating down a fucking shitheel as he's half hanging from the driver's side window... i still punch passing cars when they try to make it through the cross walk. you think they'd slow down for a stroller, wouldn't you?

fuck drivers. fuck drivers, fuck drivers.

get the fuck out of your armored box and try that shit ASSHOLE! fucking twat, fucking cankerous cunt... yeah, i called you an asshole toecutter.

Wouldn't the kick from a nine be a problem on a bicycle?

[ForrestBlack]

get the fuck out of your armored box and try that shit ASSHOLE! fucking twat, fucking cankerous cunt... yeah, i called you an asshole toecutter.

Psshhh... I'll get out of my armored box and get into it with someone being a total reckless nuisance, but it seems like CM riders only have balls enough to instigate trouble when there are 100 or more of them.

I obey traffic laws and right of way for riders. I even used to race BMX. I'm not the enemy and I shouldn't be treated as such. I also don't lean out the window and smack vegans in the head with a steak because I'm not a vegetarian.

Why should I put up with some sanctimonious twit scraping his Schwinn down the side of my ride to make some kind of a point, like I own Standard Oil.

I telecommute.

[Morning Glory]

I also don't lean out the window and smack vegans in the head with a steak because I'm not a vegetarian.

but you do eat the flesh of a dead cow, which is kind of what veggies are opposed to.

[Morning Glory]

(continuation of above post that was cut off for time.) That's like saying that someone who is anti-war because they believe that killing people is wrong shouldn't be offended by it as long as they don't have to fight.

What people should really be mad about is the fact that (in most places and cases) there is no alternative to lots of people riding bicycles (or driving cars) at the same time other than in a way that blocks traffic. As it's been pointed out when bikes block traffic its a public nuisance, when cars do it to each other every single day no one does anything except repeat the same situation tommorrow. If anything you'd think that people would stop and realize how fucked up the traffic situation we have now is and how inefficient it is. But it's always easier just to blame someone else then to take any real measures to fix the problem and then you can just keep on blaming over and over again.

The other thing is that if you insist that your way is the right way and anyone who does otherwise is wrong (such as the belief that you are entitled to drive you gas guzzler down the road without any hinderance, but bikes may not do the same) then you really shouldn't be surprised when someone else comes along with the same attitude (such as you're an asshole and i'm going to ride my bike and I don't care where you need to go.)

Or how about this, a really easy solution to the problem: You get on a bike and join the Critical Mass and then you'd get to where you need to go and you wouldn't the the one stuck in traffic. That's really the whole point and what they are trying to make people see: that contrary to the car-centric viewpoint that naysays, it is possible and doable to have people commute by riding bikes.

But of course people are just going to not see that and if they do, purposely ignore all of those things.

Rule 1: Everyone Must Drive A Car. It's The Only Way To Get Anywhere.
Rule 2: Riding A Bike Doesn't Work. See Rule 1.
Rule 3: Pollution, Traffic Jams, Car Accidents Are Unaviodable and They Certainly Will Not Be Stopped By Infringing On Rules 1 and 2.

[ForrestBlack]

but you do eat the flesh of a dead cow, which is kind of what veggies are opposed to.

See, it's a matter of mutual respect though. I'm not pushing my issues on them and they shouldn't push theirs on me. I don't mind if they communicate their agenda to me, just as I would hope they would be willing to listen to my view, but once it gets into the zone of attempted physical intimidation and hostile provocation towards random law abiding respectful passers by, it's over the line.

They can advocate their choice just as validly as I can advocate mine. But, for some reason it's ok to run red lights when you have 200 people on bikes and it's ok to bang on the hoods and windows of passing cars, and it's ok to ride the wrong way into oncoming traffic and try to pick fights with the driver that had to slam on their brakes to avoid hitting you in the middle of the night on a dark curvy road, all because someone thinks they have some politically correct agenda to push.

I'd be totally supportive if they rode five thousand bikes holding signs communicating their views, so long as they obey the traffic law. I don't get to put my bumper in front of the foreign car next to me at a stoplight and bang on their hood and stuff because I might disagree with some importation policy they may or may not have benefitted from. I'd probably get hit or cause and accident or something. That wouldn't make me some kind of righteous martyr at all.

If I was riding my bike with the CM people for example, I'd still think it was wrong to harass random drivers the way they do and I don't think I could stand to see it go on in any group I was trying to be a part of. It undermines the credibility of the message they are trying to get across. The same goes for supposed environmentalists that throw burning trashcans through the front windows of small businesses during their protests. I'm not saying everyone there causes problems but tolerance of the trouble makers within the group means there is a certain amount of responsibility the group should take as a whole.