wtf hapd to punk

[Odb69]

i have a son im old but he's got the spirit proud to say read a article about back in 92 it was wierd for chix to have blue hair n a nose ring wtf back in 80 i loved it did all my own piercings lived n am a halfbreed german but heh lol still tippn sidewayz

[VoltaireBlue]

I blame blink182.

[VoldtaEngler]

i blame green day

[OliX]

welcome?!

[VoltaireBlue]

^^^^^^^^^yeah, them too. (I meant greenday)

[OliX]

good night...

I blame offspring....

[Head Wreck]

i blame grunge.

seriously


and i think it just evolved and gave birth to many new genres of music. punk is nearly 30 years old now, it may have a revival but the generation that spawned it are bringing up their own by now. look how Goth has changed over the years and how people perceive it. like kids now who believe HiM is goth, so did the green day and offspring generation (btw, i do like a bit of the offspring's early stuff and green days dookie album still gets some play here) percieve that as being punk, and the fasion changed with that generation.

its all good. things must evolve, otherwise everyone would be driving ford duece's and not just the rodders. (okay. now i have yet another bad auto spending urge i cannot afford.....)

as the great prophets Beavis and Butthead once mused. "you need stuff that sucks, to have stuff that's cool" now, just like the ford deuce coupes, the ones that do Punk, do it GOOOOOD.

[Bikerpunk]

Is turning an ode to nihilism "THERE'S NO FUTURE FOR YOU" really "evolving" when it becomes "what's my age again?"

[KilLAtomiK]

i like blink 182, their old stuff. It reminds me of my youth.

[Morning Glory]

me thinks it's decline is linked to the rise of illiteracy.

[Velvet-Tongue]

From my one friend back in florida I talk to who considers herself a punk; they still have alot of shows. Just more underground I suppose.

[P I L O T]

I get mad so much really great punk music is no where to be found(hosted) on the web,... yet I find old rap music,.. maybe people just do enought to keep punk alive,.. i don't know.

truely a shame.

[Black Spiral Dancer]

http://www.chumba.com/

[blackienig]

Its still around, only the old stuff is good, all the new punk bands are fags.

[Morning Glory]

It's still around, only WE are old.

I don't know about you, but all the people I know that were/are punks either became mainstream or else they became more radical and they are involved in politics and art. I'd rather hear folk and dance music than another 25 Germs covers, it's not new and rebellous to me anymore. and now we're looking at the kids with spiked hair and thinking, that used to be me? It was fun, but I can't go back to that, I want something more now.

I never thought I'd get old, but now that I am, I don't have any urge to do the things that I did in highschool again or hang out with kids who are now.

I think that I'm more punk now than I ever was, because now I really know what the fuck I'm doing when I'm trying to do my own thing, even if it's not wearing a mohawk.

[Bikerpunk]

It's kinda lame to be in yr 30s and into punk...

[Morning Glory]

it's lamer to be in your 30s and not into punk.

[DreamKrusher]

What happened to punk? The record industry, Hollywood, Hot Topic, and tattoo magazines.... Ecccccchhhhhh!!! the last good punk was around in the mid-80's

[Bikerpunk]

it's lamer to be in your 30s and not into punk.

Not true. It's kind of like writing band names on your notebook. That Twisted Sister logo you drew on your binder for math class at 13 is par for the course. Doing it on your appointment book, even if you're something rock and roll like a tattoo artist, is pretty childish.

Liking the music is one thing. Wandering around with anarchy symbols written on the toes of your Chucks in pen is kinda kiddy.

[Cafe_Post_Mortem]

Nostalgia killed punk. Just like every other music scene.

Seriously, as we are blaming whatever pseudo punk band we hear on the radio ask yourself this, how much punk was on the radio back when punk was cool? Sure Hot Topic and friends commercialized whatever aspects of punk they could, but what does that have to do with music?

Meanwhile some really talented punk bands are out there playing clubs for very little money on indie labels or self produced, just like always. Once if a while a punk band will make it big, just like always.

Punk didn't die because kids started buying manic panic and creepers, it died when people started sitting around wondering why punk died.

[Head Wreck]

its odd. a lot of the volonteers that helped the band i managed* were 18-20 and we used to drag them out on a night out. every so often a song would blast out like Alice Coopers Poison and the stage hands would woop and hi 5, yelling "this song rocks"

i just kept thinking. "fuck, i must be getting old. i remember this being released"

i think the commercialisation has a part share in the blame.




* self destructed literally the period inbetween a music video being shot and ended the day before out copies were delivered in the mail

[KilLAtomiK]

i think it realy died when people started to argue about what is, and what isnt punk. just enjoy the music if it makes you feel good, if not move on to something else

[Morning Glory]

What happened to punk? The record industry, Hollywood, Hot Topic, and tattoo magazines.... Ecccccchhhhhh!!! the last good punk was around in the mid-80's

tattoo magazines really suck.

[Amelia G]

it's lamer to be in your 30s and not into punk.

Absolutely. I agree 100%.

I think there are dominant culture forces, such as the co-opting weasels behind Hot Topic, who would like for punk and any other counterculture to be reduced to trends for teenagers. That way nothing ever changes and they keep their slice of the pie just the way they want it. Anyone who believes that it is only okay to be punk or gothic or whatever until they are sixteen or something is just letting themselves be manipulated.

[OliX]

True as well Amelia, but what about people that just found out there's better music style for them than punk and moved on?

[Amelia G]

True as well Amelia, but what about people that just found out there's better music style for them than punk and moved on?

Nothing wrong with having your taste grow and evolve. Musical interests could start in any genre and move on to any other. I just think that it is dangerously conformist to accept the notion that punk equals juvenile and too young to make a difference, too young to have power or influence.

[OliX]

Very true. We're talking about Punk lifestyle now and not music style
Even when I started listening to death and grind metal I still noted "I'm punk deep in my soul".... but not anymore. Now I'm just Ollie

[a_small_death]

i shall always blame it on emo

[Bikerpunk]

Absolutely. I agree 100%.

I think there are dominant culture forces, such as the co-opting weasels behind Hot Topic, who would like for punk and any other counterculture to be reduced to trends for teenagers. That way nothing ever changes and they keep their slice of the pie just the way they want it. Anyone who believes that it is only okay to be punk or gothic or whatever until they are sixteen or something is just letting themselves be manipulated.

Sure, but photocopying zines at 44, while trying to eke out a living wiping windshields with a squeegee because you've not bathed in months, have a dog, and a "Smash the state" leather jacket that stands up by itself, is pathetic.

Ditto Goth. A man wearing pale foundation and eyeliner works in his teens and early 20s. There's a reason Goth artists knock that off later on in life. You end up looking like Michael Jackson.

Nothing to say you can't listen to the music, go to the concerts, enjoy the aesthetic. Some dude like the Beastie Boys can pull off wearing Minor Threat T-shirts and such at their age, but only cause they change how they do it.

[VoltaireBlue]

Sure, but photocopying zines at 44, while trying to eke out a living wiping windshields with a squeegee because you've not bathed in months, have a dog, and a "Smash the state" leather jacket that stands up by itself, is pathetic.

I disagree entirely. there is nothing wrong with being 44, 54, 64, or even 74 and copying zines. a really good friend of mine is still writing his zine, is probably still travelling, and probably still dresses like an east bay punk. I don't know about the dog though, I haven't seen him in a long time now.... but I do still buy his zine when I can, because he's an outstanding writer. I hope he writes and makes zines until he dies.

Ditto Goth. A man wearing pale foundation and eyeliner works in his teens and early 20s. There's a reason Goth artists knock that off later on in life. You end up looking like Michael Jackson.

I have to dissagree again. who's to say that you're supposed to stop doing anything at a certain age? both scar and I knew a guy that was even older than me, and still wearing makeup. he wore way too much, but I backed him because he knew who he was and wasn't afraid of it. again, who's to say how old is too old? It makes me think that you care too much about what other people think.

Nothing to say you can't listen to the music, go to the concerts, enjoy the aesthetic. Some dude like the Beastie Boys can pull off wearing Minor Threat T-shirts and such at their age, but only cause they change how they do it.

fuck the beastie boys. the only time I subject myself to them is when there are college boys or peckerwoods in the bar I'm stripping in, so I can take thier money.

On a final note, I happen to be ** years old and I know exactly who I am. I'm not afraid of it. I'm covered in tattoos, still don't have a real job, and I still dress like an east bay punk 75%of the time. the other 25% I am dressed up in my fineries for club night... I would still dye my hair cool colors if I could decide on one to keep for more than two weeks, because bleaching your hair too much fries the shit out of it..... I will probably always be a freak. I will probably have dreads again someday too when my hair gets long again. and NO ONE IS GOING TO MAKE ME FEEL BAD ABOUT IT, BECAUSE I DON'T CARE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE THINK...... I will always do what ever I want .............
the end.

[VoltaireBlue]

it's lamer to be in your 30s and not into punk.

I think it's lamer to be in your 30's and not even know what it is. just because you're 30 shouldn't mean you're into punk, just because you remember it. people change, and it wasn't alot of people's cup of tea back then anyway...

[Mindgames]

..and I'll just sit in the corner and ponder at the differences between US and UK punk; which is or is not a knock-off of the other, and how vehement defense of something seems to be possible without necessarily understanding it in the first place. I won't ponder the rationale of the phrase "the lady doth protest too much" as I need a few more drinks.

Freud would've loved you guys...




(...but he'd have really loved your mothers)

[Amelia G]

I disagree entirely. there is nothing wrong with being 44, 54, 64, or even 74 and copying zines. a really good friend of mine is still writing his zine, is probably still travelling, and probably still dresses like an east bay punk. I don't know about the dog though, I haven't seen him in a long time now.... but I do still buy his zine when I can, because he's an outstanding writer. I hope he writes and makes zines until he dies.



I have to dissagree again. who's to say that you're supposed to stop doing anything at a certain age? both scar and I knew a guy that was even older than me, and still wearing makeup. he wore way too much, but I backed him because he knew who he was and wasn't afraid of it. again, who's to say how old is too old? It makes me think that you care too much about what other people think.



fuck the beastie boys. the only time I subject myself to them is when there are college boys or peckerwoods in the bar I'm stripping in, so I can take thier money.

On a final note, I happen to be ** years old and I know exactly who I am. I'm not afraid of it. I'm covered in tattoos, still don't have a real job, and I still dress like an east bay punk 75%of the time. the other 25% I am dressed up in my fineries for club night... I would still dye my hair cool colors if I could decide on one to keep for more than two weeks, because bleaching your hair too much fries the shit out of it..... I will probably always be a freak. I will probably have dreads again someday too when my hair gets long again. and NO ONE IS GOING TO MAKE ME FEEL BAD ABOUT IT, BECAUSE I DON'T CARE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE THINK...... I will always do what ever I want .............
the end.

Amen, sister!

[ForrestBlack]

Sure, but photocopying zines at 44, while trying to eke out a living wiping windshields with a squeegee because you've not bathed in months, have a dog, and a "Smash the state" leather jacket that stands up by itself, is pathetic.

Ditto Goth. A man wearing pale foundation and eyeliner works in his teens and early 20s. There's a reason Goth artists knock that off later on in life. You end up looking like Michael Jackson.

Nothing to say you can't listen to the music, go to the concerts, enjoy the aesthetic. Some dude like the Beastie Boys can pull off wearing Minor Threat T-shirts and such at their age, but only cause they change how they do it.

So, essentially, you are saying that a grown up should be in different economic circumstances than they were when they were young? That a Gothic look is going to be expected to be more refined over time and that perhaps a smash the state agenda needs a little bit of power than can be expected from a young runaway squatter punk? I mean, if I'm reading your examples right, Beastie Boys have created their own success, so they get to wear the Minor Threat t-shirt and it's ok?

I can certainly get with the notion that counter-culture needs to acquire some success and power over time so as not to appear pathetic. That was your point, right?

[Exquisite]

Wear what you like, listen to whatever music you like and who gives a flying fuck. I mean really people the label thing is so boring.

I have purple hair, but I wear a business suit to work, the people there call me punk rock and then my friends who wear nothing but bondage pants and ripped up t-shirts call me conservative ... after I've paid for lunch. Meh ... neither opinion matters as long as I'm doing what I want.

[Morning Glory]

I think it's lamer to be in your 30's and not even know what it is. just because you're 30 shouldn't mean you're into punk, just because you remember it. people change, and it wasn't alot of people's cup of tea back then anyway...

sure, I mean you shouldn't be into punk if...you're not into punk. But you should if you want to be. I just said that to make a play on words, but i'm super stoked that it got people to say what I actually wanted to say, like you and amelia did.

I just really hate the bourgeois notion that social consciousness, creativity, adventure, rebellion, is this little insignificant thing of no real consequence that everyone goes through when they are young and then comes to their senses and grows up and out of, and has the wisdom to look down at.

Don't let people dictate to you what the meaning of your life is. that's always been what punk has been about and mean to me.

[Head Wreck]

people can be who they want to be, theres no law which says by the third hour of your 30th birthday you should be X, Y, Z

i am 25, i happen to dress like most other civil servants by day. but i know plenty of people older than me who still go all out,

a good friend of mine once said "its a bad idea to put time-scales on things, things happen in thier own time and in their own way" she is probably twoce my age and visually more goth then most people. she works, has two daughters who have turned out pretty damned "screwwed on"

after all fasions are the clothes, not the person

[goodthink]

Counter-culture can never be widely accepted by broad audiences because it is, well, counter to the prevailing culture.

That said, once anything becomes prevalent in society it is no longer alarmist, non-conformist, radical or counter-culture, it becomes part of the noise that makes up the package called, the establishment.

Oh, and being non-conformist is, in fact, being a conformist.

[ForrestBlack]

Counter-culture can never be widely accepted by broad audiences because it is, well, counter to the prevailing culture.

That said, once anything becomes prevalent in society it is no longer alarmist, non-conformist, radical or counter-culture, it becomes part of the noise that makes up the package called, the establishment.

Oh, and being non-conformist is, in fact, being a conformist.

That is a popular but false perspective, pushed by the status quo.

If you 'rebel' by questioning the status quo and acting to change it where it should be changed, that is an exorcise in social growth. What was once seen as an out on a limb perspective is now frequently a commonly accepted stance. If your goal was simply to be a rebel and you achieved your stated or chosen cause and you didn't adapt or grow your cause, you would in fact no longer particularly be a rebel. This is true. But, the notion that someone might be satisfied after achieving all they wanted is a pretty ignorant justification to dissuade people from pushing for a world they want to live in in the first place.

It is only through this drive towards positive change that we can advance, even if sometimes it's a bit by bit pace. Symbolically, what was once crazy hair, for example, is now more acceptable. That doesn't mean I should no longer like it. Our society has gotten away from a forced stance of conformity. I can now more openly socialize with people of different races and open sexual preference than my grandparents could.

Counter for the sake of counter is just silly, but I do not accept that any push to move or at least influence the mainstream or other social power base for more open acceptance of perfectly legitimate lifestyle choices and/or a more open minded approach to diversity, or whatever your particular counterculture agenda might be, is somehow a waste of time.

Freedom is not slavery.

[OliX]

I disagree entirely. there is nothing wrong with being 44, 54, 64, or even 74 and copying zines. a really good friend of mine is still writing his zine, is probably still travelling, and probably still dresses like an east bay punk. I don't know about the dog though, I haven't seen him in a long time now.... but I do still buy his zine when I can, because he's an outstanding writer. I hope he writes and makes zines until he dies.



I have to dissagree again. who's to say that you're supposed to stop doing anything at a certain age? both scar and I knew a guy that was even older than me, and still wearing makeup. he wore way too much, but I backed him because he knew who he was and wasn't afraid of it. again, who's to say how old is too old? It makes me think that you care too much about what other people think.



fuck the beastie boys. the only time I subject myself to them is when there are college boys or peckerwoods in the bar I'm stripping in, so I can take thier money.

On a final note, I happen to be ** years old and I know exactly who I am. I'm not afraid of it. I'm covered in tattoos, still don't have a real job, and I still dress like an east bay punk 75%of the time. the other 25% I am dressed up in my fineries for club night... I would still dye my hair cool colors if I could decide on one to keep for more than two weeks, because bleaching your hair too much fries the shit out of it..... I will probably always be a freak. I will probably have dreads again someday too when my hair gets long again. and NO ONE IS GOING TO MAKE ME FEEL BAD ABOUT IT, BECAUSE I DON'T CARE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE THINK...... I will always do what ever I want .............
the end.

such a rebel
I think I'm falling in love