Do you think people have stopped dressing up (in the gothic way) like they used to??

[Scar]

Do you think people have stopped dressing up (in the gothic way) like they used to??

When I look back at my old photo albums and reminisce about the past I can't help but notice how FABULOUS people used to look. Now, I only started really going out to clubs like 7 years ago, so I was never around for the peak of goth, whenever that was (I just know it was before my time cause 7 years ago people were already talking about 'back in the day'). But even in that much time I have noticed the decline of fashion. Now I am the one referring to 'back in the day' with the huge burden of nostalgia.

For a while I thought I was imagining things. I thought perhaps just the thrill of going out and seeing beautiful spooky people had worn off and I was jaded in my old age. Perhaps I was imagining things, cause other people still seem excited about going out. Other people, of course, being those in the range of 18-20 years of age. Then I looked back at my old photo albums and those of my friends and realized I am not imagining things, in fact the scene is a slightly duller place.

I don't mean to talk down about our little culture, I assure you. I am just wondering if you all have noticed the same thing wherever you live, and if anyone has some theories about why this is happening. For the life of me I can't figure out why :-(

[One Eyed Cat]

I would have to agree with you. I've always been understated, but around here I would practically be "glam" on some nights. Someone posted MPLS "darksider" (that's an all-purpose term used here) photos circe 80s and 90s. The difference was striking when I compared it to folks I see now. I don't really see it as good or bad really. It is different though.

The only day is today though. Just give the folks an aesthetic enema they won't forget. Back in the day. I say that occasionally. It's silly.

JT

[HeadlessBill]

I would venture to say, 'Yes and No'. I've never really been part of the Goth scene until recently (I point the finger at my documentary), but from interviews I've conducted this is touched upon slightly.

But, in a nutshell, as the younger and newer generations enter the scene, they bring a bit of the style and attitude they had into it.

I wish I could explain it better, but if you look back, a lot of the looks that were once Goth are no longer popular. The Romantic or Victorian Goths, the Vampires, the CyberGoths are rarely seen now. Even by the people that prefer to dress that way when they go out. But newer stuff seems to be creeping in. There are some Goths that are getting into Steampunk and seem to be incorporating some of that into the scene.

Also, Hot Topic, I think has also had a hand in homogenizing the Goth look to what it is today as well as the way the media portrays Goth. So those entering the scene from what they see from those places will try and dress how they think they are supposed to.

I hope this made some sense rather than being a rambling mess I think it is.

[One Eyed Cat]

I would venture to say, 'Yes and No'. I've never really been part of the Goth scene until recently (I point the finger at my documentary), but from interviews I've conducted this is touched upon slightly.

But, in a nutshell, as the younger and newer generations enter the scene, they bring a bit of the style and attitude they had into it.

I wish I could explain it better, but if you look back, a lot of the looks that were once Goth are no longer popular. The Romantic or Victorian Goths, the Vampires, the CyberGoths are rarely seen now. Even by the people that prefer to dress that way when they go out. But newer stuff seems to be creeping in. There are some Goths that are getting into Steampunk and seem to be incorporating some of that into the scene.

Also, Hot Topic, I think has also had a hand in homogenizing the Goth look to what it is today as well as the way the media portrays Goth. So those entering the scene from what they see from those places will try and dress how they think they are supposed to.

I hope this made some sense rather than being a rambling mess I think it is.

Could you explain steampunk to me? That's another word being thrown around. How does it apply to fashion? It would seem to imply the victorian age. How does it differ from other folks who simply like that aesthetic?

JT

[HeadlessBill]

It is Victorian age, just throw in the elements at attitudes of CyberPunk, but using Victorian technology. Wikipedia has a more lengthy description.

There are better examples, but the ones that come to mind.

Girl Genius
Steampunk inspired watches

[malcolm]

i do. out here its al juggalo this and juggalltte that.so annoying. i wil admit heres just something abot ciks wearing clown pain thts so fuckin ht butall in the same not so many goths..........hell, i dont even consider myself goth anymore i suppose i never have been a hundred percent peggabl to any category....although i still wannaget a pair of those baggy as industrial pants with thecains ad shit, they lok like hakamas from hell.

[mmmcherry]

The Romantic or Victorian Goths, the Vampires, the CyberGoths are rarely seen now

those were the most fabulous i think i never seen any out anywhere but yeah... i liked what i saw on tv and stuff

and yeah hot topic... ewww... i saw a pink tank top once at hot topic that said "metal" on it... in like flowey english script... i wanted to hurl.

hehee malcolm... I FUCKING LOVE THOSE KINDS OF PANTS (the industrial kind you like) i say totally get some... and get some for me too if you want hehee

[malcolm]

those were the most fabulous i think i never seen any out anywhere but yeah... i liked what i saw on tv and stuff

and yeah hot topic... ewww... i saw a pink tank top once at hot topic that said "metal" on it... in like flowey english script... i wanted to hurl.

hehee malcolm... I FUCKING LOVE THOSE KINDS OF PANTS (the industrial kind you like) i say totally get some... and get some for me too if you want hehee

ll have to budget em in what wth needing to get newglases and contacts and all, am getting somecrazy eyes (been wanting those a while now too) to go with my costume for hallowen and the upcoming comicon. and as far as getting you some.....sorry, charlie, after the last person i bought something for comlained i didnt get them accessories (cough gamecube!) I dont buy other people things unless they got the money.

[One Eyed Cat]

It is Victorian age, just throw in the elements at attitudes of CyberPunk, but using Victorian technology. Wikipedia has a more lengthy description.

There are better examples, but the ones that come to mind.

Girl Genius
Steampunk inspired watches

ahhh interesting. thanks. I've seen folks do this, never put a name to it.

JT

[VoldtaEngler]

I get nostalgic about "back in the day" as well...I remember "back in the day" when Hot Topic sold crushed velvet long sleeve jackets, and Goth comps. But times change and music changes.

I wish VH1 would do a "I love the 80's / 90's Goth Edition" That would be so great to watch.

As for steampunk crowd, I think I get more orders for custom steampunk goggles than pre-made designs. Which is fun for me because it lets me get my creative side out more. I love the steampunk/cyberpunk fashion and memoribilia/art. Here's a great site to visit for steampunk stuff.

Brass Goggles

Steampunk goggles I made

[Mindgames]

Scar honey, you do know how to make me laugh. "My old age" just doesn't sound right coming from someone born after Watergate.

Yes, people are less visible in style terms than they were back in the 70s/80s, but I don't put it down to 'evolution' of the genres. If that was the case people would be wearing as much stuff in as many places, just with different-shaped pants. In reality people that would've been 24/7 'freaks' in the heyday now wander about all vanilla for most of the week and only break into their style when going out, staying in or walking on stage. I think partly it's because there's more pressure to conform (before anyone says "there was before!" - there wasn't in the time I was young! No-beard-no-jewellery dress codes at work in the 70s? like.. no.). You'll always have a minority that wears the stuff despite the pressure, but kids today are taught to conform from day one so by the time they start expressing a personal theme they've learnt to accept "you don't stand out at work... you don't stand out at school... you....." is the safest way to get your comfy job, comfy house and comfy paycheck. The second issue of course is that goth is expensive to do, compared to the other genres available. Should I get a $10 sweatshirt and be nu-metal or a $300 leather cape?.. hmm... how much is the rent this week?

As to steampunk, I'd like to apologize on behalf of all the crew of Van Helsing for kickstarting a minor graphic-novel subgenre into a worldwide craze, and to mention that since League of Extraordinary Gentlemen took over the idea and ran with it, we're not accepting any liability for a generation of kids who think that the nuclear submarine was a popular means of transport in 1882, or that a man with a clockwork leg can save the universe before breakfast.

'Victorian' means England at the end of the 19th Century. People worked 26 hours a day in the mill, came home to a one-room house shared by two hundred people, ate a bucket of cold gravel, were killed to death by their fathers and then made to sleep on broken glass, all for one farthing per lifetime.


Luxury.

[Lady Alias]

A comment I happened to pass by on another forum:

"So, instead of kids dressing funny and believing they are vampires, there are kids dressing funny who think they can operate a zeppelin."

[One Eyed Cat]

A comment I happened to pass by on another forum:

"So, instead of kids dressing funny and believing they are vampires, there are kids dressing funny who think they can operate a zeppelin."

haha I'm beginning to smell Johnny Depp in on this somewhere. Comic books and Johnny Depp. Yup.

JT

[One Eyed Cat]

Scar honey, you do know how to make me laugh. "My old age" just doesn't sound right coming from someone born after Watergate.

Yes, people are less visible in style terms than they were back in the 70s/80s, but I don't put it down to 'evolution' of the genres. If that was the case people would be wearing as much stuff in as many places, just with different-shaped pants. In reality people that would've been 24/7 'freaks' in the heyday now wander about all vanilla for most of the week and only break into their style when going out, staying in or walking on stage. I think partly it's because there's more pressure to conform (before anyone says "there was before!" - there wasn't in the time I was young! No-beard-no-jewellery dress codes at work in the 70s? like.. no.). You'll always have a minority that wears the stuff despite the pressure, but kids today are taught to conform from day one so by the time they start expressing a personal theme they've learnt to accept "you don't stand out at work... you don't stand out at school... you....." is the safest way to get your comfy job, comfy house and comfy paycheck. The second issue of course is that goth is expensive to do, compared to the other genres available. Should I get a $10 sweatshirt and be nu-metal or a $300 leather cape?.. hmm... how much is the rent this week?

As to steampunk, I'd like to apologize on behalf of all the crew of Van Helsing for kickstarting a minor graphic-novel subgenre into a worldwide craze, and to mention that since League of Extraordinary Gentlemen took over the idea and ran with it, we're not accepting any liability for a generation of kids who think that the nuclear submarine was a popular means of transport in 1882, or that a man with a clockwork leg can save the universe before breakfast.

'Victorian' means England at the end of the 19th Century. People worked 26 hours a day in the mill, came home to a one-room house shared by two hundred people, ate a bucket of cold gravel, were killed to death by their fathers and then made to sleep on broken glass, all for one farthing per lifetime.


Luxury.

I'll give the British bourgeouise props for some of the clothes. It had me chuckling reading the comic though. They really stretch to incorporate Dorian Gray and Tom Sawyer into the plotline. I s'pose ole guttergoths become the Tom Sawyer prole steampunks.

JT

[Bikerpunk]

I'm just too big now.
Sorry, but they cater Goth clothes to plus size women, but not us guys who got older.

[One Eyed Cat]

I'm just too big now.
Sorry, but they cater Goth clothes to plus size women, but not us guys who got older.

Interesting. That is actually a point that I saw raised elsewhere. If it were feasible, do you think there would be interest in a company that catered to guys above the sizes generally sold retail?

JT

[One Eyed Cat]

Here is Shrine's Size Chart btw. Looks fairly inclusive:

http://www.shrinestore.com/SIZECHART.pdf

[Bikerpunk]

Only 43"?
I'm not that much of a lardass, but thanks to lifting weights I have to wear larger sizes than that (and a belt)

[One Eyed Cat]

Only 43"?
I'm not that much of a lardass, but thanks to lifting weights I have to wear larger sizes than that (and a belt)

ah k. It's larger than a lot of brands go up to though. LS goes to 38". I'm well below that, but I am curious why this market is being ignored.

JT

[Black Spiral Dancer]

I have to admit, when I go to the club we normally go to, I tend to wear an appropriate t-shirt and skin-tight jeans. This is just for comfort, not because I can't be bothered to dress up. My wife goes to great lengths to choose an outfit when we go out. The difference is I spend most of the night dancing, so get a bit "Moist", shall we say, so a t-shirt is best.

My wife is having dilemnas about outfits she needs to take to Whitby for the Goth Weekend at the end of the month. We're only going to be there from the Thursday to the Tuesday, but she needs 9 outfits. A lot will be mix'n'match skirts and corsets, but she's still panicking. I just need a couple of shirts for the evenings, t-shirts for during the day, and the final evening the theme is Zombies so I'm reprising my Shaun of the Dead outfit, with added blood.

We see all kinds of Goths there, Trad/Vamp, Cyber, Industrial, etc in varying levels of dressed-up-ness.

[Bikerpunk]

ah k. It's larger than a lot of brands go up to though. LS goes to 38". I'm well below that, but I am curious why this market is being ignored.

JT

Well, the Shrine folks said they had stock in those sizes cause they get some business from the WWF. (This was back in the Gangrel/Brood days)

Other companies were like "we don't want fat guys in our clothes KTHXBAI"

[One Eyed Cat]

Well, the Shrine folks said they had stock in those sizes cause they get some business from the WWF. (This was back in the Gangrel/Brood days)

Other companies were like "we don't want fat guys in our clothes KTHXBAI"

Seriously? How silly. I've seen it brought up enough times to know some stuff would sell.

JT

[Bikerpunk]

Seriously? How silly. I've seen it brought up enough times to know some stuff would sell.

JT

Seriously.

Telling women they need to lose weight is a no-no. Telling a guy he's just too big and studly to wear their shit is not.

[One Eyed Cat]

Seriously.

Telling women they need to lose weight is a no-no. Telling a guy he's just too big and studly to wear their shit is not.

Oh I know its no insult. I'm just thinking guys might like more choices in gear. If the shit will sell ..... makes sense to carry it.

JT

[Velvet-Tongue]

I've been to two about 2 gothic clubs and well..Dragon*Con(I'd venture to call it Goth Con considering all the panels and people in goth clothing ).

What I remember seeing alot of was hair extensions. Two pony tails with noodles and sparkly things in them. LOts of fettish wear and lots of utility kilts, trip pants, and black t-shirts.

The last "romantic/victorian" goth I saw at a Rock Concert. So I'd say they're going the way of the dodo.

May just have been because of the band I was there to see(Cruxshadows) attracts that type of fashion though.

[Mr Karl]

styles always change....fact of life

[Mindgames]

Bikerpunk/JT:- I agree that there's very little beyond 'S M L XL' in goth (or any other alt theme) male clothing, but as to the commercial viability of it I'm not so sure. If there was a market there'd be a supply, as most of the people producing goth clothing are low-output businesses and more than eager to exploit every opportunity they can find. Salad-phobic goths have been around since The Cure was still just The Clinical Trial, so if there's no oversize stuff in the stores there's a commercial reason people aren't putting it there, beyond the stereotype that all goth boys are skinny little oiks.

[evilstonermonkey]

heh on the issues on clothing sizes i think australia has a pretty good way of explaing why theres plus-size chicks clothes in teh g0thic range but not stuff for bigger men.

unfortunately over here, there are two species of goth, homo morbidus mascula and homo morbidus femina.
chicks: become goth because they realise the only way their, ahem, extra cushioning and dog-like features will be 'okay' is if they become 'alternative' and pretend they havent even noticed
dudes: become goth because they realise their skinny, birdlike arms and pasty pimply basement skin will only be acceptable if you are wearing black and saying you chose to not be good at sports.

[Black Spiral Dancer]

I find it very hard to find skin tight jeans, since there is only one shop in Newcastle that can supply the public with Phaze clothing (they have an exclusive contract that says that no other company in the region can stock Phaze clothing, and since the Phaze warehouse is local to us, they agreed to it). The shop in question refuses to get in the Phaze "Rockmaster" canvas jean as they aren't the style they want to promote. They prefer the Dance/Clubwear, and they don't want Trad Goths.
It's annoying since a friend of mine runs a business in Durham and would love to sell Phaze Rockmaster Jeans, but since this shop has a stranglehold on the market, there's nothing they can do.

[Bikerpunk]

evilstonermonkey for the win.

[One Eyed Cat]

Bikerpunk/JT:- I agree that there's very little beyond 'S M L XL' in goth (or any other alt theme) male clothing, but as to the commercial viability of it I'm not so sure. If there was a market there'd be a supply, as most of the people producing goth clothing are low-output businesses and more than eager to exploit every opportunity they can find. Salad-phobic goths have been around since The Cure was still just The Clinical Trial, so if there's no oversize stuff in the stores there's a commercial reason people aren't putting it there, beyond the stereotype that all goth boys are skinny little oiks.

I see some interest though. I guess there just isn't enough of the saladophobes for it to be viable still. I'm looking to expand local business for folks, but the saladophobes ain't gonna like the prices if we have to make the stuff. I have heard it brought up by such folks in a few states now though.

JT

[One Eyed Cat]

heh on the issues on clothing sizes i think australia has a pretty good way of explaing why theres plus-size chicks clothes in teh g0thic range but not stuff for bigger men.

unfortunately over here, there are two species of goth, homo morbidus mascula and homo morbidus femina.
chicks: become goth because they realise the only way their, ahem, extra cushioning and dog-like features will be 'okay' is if they become 'alternative' and pretend they havent even noticed
dudes: become goth because they realise their skinny, birdlike arms and pasty pimply basement skin will only be acceptable if you are wearing black and saying you chose to not be good at sports.

I haven't found that to be the case universally.

JT

[incog]

I don't think most people would consider me to be Gothic at all ever but all subcultures used to dress up more. At least in Los Angeles and most of the places I have toured. Brazil and Japan are both still pretty good.

[evilstonermonkey]

JT: i didnt think it was. but you have to admit, it strikes pretty close to the bone sometimes doesnt it?

[Vaughn]

People should get dressed up more.
Things are so boring..
Maybe not so much like they "used to" but at least make some sort of effort.

[One Eyed Cat]

JT: i didnt think it was. but you have to admit, it strikes pretty close to the bone sometimes doesnt it?

I hear it more these days then I used to. When I was in PA, this was prevalent enough to be *the* cliche. Overall? There's so many peeps out there. There are a lot of different "looks".

JT

[ObscureZan]

Yes unfortunantly there has been a decline in the Goth Fashion...it makes me sad~ Although I do have my 'Street Goth' clothes that I wear to school because some of my more elaborate outfits would just be hell trying to run around in and get art supplies and tattoo ink on them T_T But I do prefere the Elegant Goth/Victorian Goth look that's getting harder and harder to find. I've resolved to making/customizing most of my clothes or having to order them from a Japanese company called "Moi-Meme-Moitie" and another couple favourites, "Black Peace Now", "Juliette et Justine", "Atelier-Pierrot", "h.Naoto" and "HelloHell" by "ReBirth" which is actually a korean company. I'll try to get some pics up if anybody's interested +^_^+ *floats off to finish a freakin still life*

[malcolm]

Seriously.

Telling women they need to lose weight is a no-no. Telling a guy he's just too big and studly to wear their shit is not.

i'd try the fucker on just for spite fi i waas toldthat one! lol. sigh....i wish i was sixteen again, 120 pounds and full head of braided hair with the body of a flat chested cheerleader. I used to love that! I''d sneak out makeup from the boyshome and put it on in the bathroom and braid my hair up and i'd always get comments like "is that a guy or a girl?" i still got comments ike that when i did drag but thats cus I know how to hook up the makeup and wigs lol

[gothic rose]

as a member of one of the younger generations
i constanly get called a poser for dressing goth
im cyber goth
and people dont get how i can be goth and include bright colors...
i always get called emo or somthing offensive to me
and that makes me not wanna dress how i love to dress
and just wear jeans and a tee-shirt
indivdiuality is no longer embraced unless its the exact copy of "individuality" that everyone one else has
its sad being a teen(im 18) in todays society

[Michelle Aston]

I have always had my own wierd way of dressing, and the more offensive I am it works in my favor. I tend to have an entire seat to myself on the bus/train, I get stronger drinks at the bar, and I don't get knocked over by cars b/c they see my mohawk a mile away. I do get a million questions, but if I mutter something about needing my medication...I have serenity on a stick.