Fashion after nude?

[Jax]

Im pretty excited because Ive been contacted by a photographer that Im going to shoot with out in NY the end of Nov. Hes been passing on my pictures to some high fashion photographers out there who have all apparantly shown interest in shooting high fashion shoots with me. This will expand my portfolio as well as giving their portfolio a boost for shooting more edgy shoots, and Im hoping this will lead to bigger things! Im not counting my chickens before they are hatched, nor will I say who some of these photographers are until Ive actually shot with them, but Im excited none the less.

So, if Forrest and Amelia post any of the other sets I did with them last year (bug them to get them up, they are killer sets!), they will be my last sets of alternative erotica ever. Even if it doesnt pick up for me, I highly doubt Ill be doing anymore erotica or nude shoots anymore. Since my career is picking up, Ive decided to be extremely selective in the shoots I do;]

[ForrestBlack]

I think it's an unsophisticated point of view to put too much of a separation between genuinely artistic nudes and edge fashion. Show me any compelling successful internationally known models and I know for a stone cold fact there are sexy edgy erotic nudes out there of them too.

[Jax]

Well, the only nudes Ive ever liked doing were with you guys, but its kinda hard to shoot anymore when we live so far apart and I cant do as much as Id like with blueblood. Plus I have a normal career going for me, so whats the point in continuing doing any nudes when I have tons of pictures being nude, and I dont enjoy it with other photographers?

[Mindgames]

Great to hear things are looking favorable for you hon - the 'look' is getting a hell of a lot better in 06/07 than it has been in the last few years, especially for NYC and Paris (I don't haunt catwalks, but since I create virtual people I have to keep abreast of what the market wants.. it's a bastard of a job to search through Storm's catalogs for "the ass of 2007"). Recently it's been post-heroin-chic with an ethnic diversity pompom on top, but the models used in most shoots remain mannequins - the idea that the model's body has a strong look in itself has always been a no-no, as it "detracted from the clothes". People are starting to see that the clothes are often pretty fckin boring and using a model with strong features can pull in attention so long as the genres match. I really do hope that you get a lead into the market Jax, but with the very greatest respect I'm not sure it's going to be easy to cross genres. You're visually unique, which is a good thing, but you may be too identifiable to appeal to more than one client. It's the "Eva effect" - since doing the 'Hello Boys' campaign nobody else would risk her for months as the public would've assumed she was still advertising the same brand, but a new one. If you get a foot in with a strong campaign it can see you right for months, but the market is overfull right now of 'safe bets'. personally I hate 'safe' but if you're a unit-shifter for Gap, you want someone even more boring than your pants.

Right, that aside... this whole 'nude vs. normal' thing really gets me vexed. I avoid getting drawn into it usually (hence the lack of my replies to Amelia's freebie threads), but hell.. it's Saturday and it's raining, and it's Jax. Three good reasons to bore you or start a fight.

I agree with Forrest, and with Jax. 'Fashion' shoots tend to involve clothes, sure. not always a full set of them, but the idea is to make you look at the fabric, not at the nipples. 'Normal' work to me means a contract whose goal is not simply to arouse the audience - it's not important if the models are dressed or not, it's the concept that counts. Lots of fashion models (of both sexes) will flag their cards against nude but carry shots in their books because they were "arty" - and I agree entirely. There's a world of difference between a centerfold and a calendar, and a calendar and a gallery print. It's not just the anatomical poses it's the entire concept - something bigger than just the arrangement of someone's knees. Having said that I don't see why one genre is 'bad'. If a model wants to stay clothed all the time, then fine. Lots of us like to imagine what we're missing, or frankly don't care about the rest if the image itself is good - would the Mona Lisa be 'better' if she was naked? Is that even a question?

Blueblood ain't porn. I know millions will say it is, and Amelia and Forrest spend their lives saying it's not, but it's really not. What Jax has in her portfolio ain't porn. An image taken to look good because of the composition, lighting and scenery is a good image no matter what the person in it is wearing. Sure it's erotica, and models such as Jax clearly get visitors perky - but I can understand what she's saying about BB being 'different' to the usual concrete-floor-and-Pentax brigade. Porn is there for one purpose - it doesn't have to look good, it just has to trigger the right receptors and divert your blood supply. The belly of the industry doesn't try any harder than that, but the decent sector puts in the effort to be 'erotic' not 'pornographic'. I haven't a problem with people who seriously want to be at the bottom of the heap, and some of them are nice enough people (if a little depressed most times), but it's only a 'bad thing' for those who don't like it. It's not inherently a mark against someone's future career or morality as a human.

I don't think nowadays that having a 'past' has any bearing on your ability to get work. Your bone structure, ink and the things you're prepared to allow someone to do to your hair (like that'll be a problem... hah!) all matter, but everyone who's anyone has a collection of shots running round the Web that they wouldn't do again. I don't mean it's something you should be ashamed of - but equally you shouldn't allow anyone to become ashamed on your behalf.

What's important is that the model is happy with the project, and happy for it to be around forever. "No regrets" comes from careful choices. Sure, we all make screw-ups, but a model being forced into a concept they're not 110% comfortable with is a massive issue with me - I've been known to remove teeth over it and it's why even though I build people digitally these days I still treat my little creations as people with morals. I'm proud to say some of my best friends are in the industry, but it's still a dangerous place to risk your dreams on. If Jax wants to change her selectivity then nobody has the right to argue, and to remind the crowd who will post saying "oh noes! we want nipplezzzz!" - you're talking about a human being and a potential friend, not a piece of property.

I could go on for hours about this subject (as anyone who gets me on AIM will attest) but you're already thinking "shut the fcuk up em-gee!" so I will.

mG

[Anarkey]

Hey good luck and hope you do well, i think a highProfile Fashion shoot would be kool , but tell em its a hobbie ..
and Forest would know alot about that stuff i bet , i mean damm look at His pic;s ,,hes the best !
but any hoo ,Good Luck!
A

[Sara X]

i'm so happy for you, and jealous at the same time... knock 'em dead!

[*HarLequiN*]

Sorry and happy at the same time.
Sorry to see a beautiful women get away from erotica-shots and happy to know that she'll get on with her career.
Good night and good luck!

[Bondage Clown]

you will still talk to us right? *quietly whimpering about her leaving forever*

[Nyarlathotep]

I'm moving to Chicago in the winter, where I hope to be studying fashion (assuming I survive first year). My perspective: it seems like the designer would want to choose a model that was best for the clothing styles that they were presenting. Someone doing high-end fetish gear probably isn't going to want a typical haute couture/heroin chic model. Personally, with the stuff I like sewing currently, I would prefer to use people that have tattoos and piercings. ...But I'm not a 'real' artist until I've finished spending $100k on art school, so my opinion doesn't really matter. :P

In other words, I agree with Mindgames.

Useless aside: There is starting to be a backlash against models that are too skinny. I think that two fashion weeks (Spain and England, I think...?) banned models that fell below a specific minimum on body mass charts. Nice to know that models might start looking more like real people. Now if only the gawdawful hair could be fixed...

Aside to Jax: You look very familiar, particularly the leopard spots. Are you either on iam.*******, or did you go to ModCon III? I'm probably wrong.

[badkittyamy]

Without trying to go off topic I simply find it ridiculous that society (at least the ones the people that poluate this forum belong to at least) are so pre-ocupied with decorum and what not.

I really don't see why nudity is such a big thing, one of the best things I ever got to do while here at SCAD was my life drawing class where we only had nude models to work with. Nude does not have to mean sexual, it was so refreshing to be able to study the human form.

There is nothing I enjoy more than studying the nude form, it's just to bad that even among friends (well some of mine will) just get naked and be comfortable with it.

Pertaining to the topic at hand though whatever makes you happy Jax, to say i won't be dissapointed to see more sets with you nude would be a lie, but then your body mods entrigue me and one will never get the full effect with clothes covering half of them.

[Nyarlathotep]

Western society is based on Judeo-Christian principles, which have a pretty dim view of human sexuality. Many people still subscribe to this value system.

I think that nudity is contextual; drawing a model is not generally sexual (depending on the particulars of the pose, but if your getting aroused as you draw, your drawing's gonna look like shit). An STD check definitely isn't erotic. But a strip club is. Some people see an erotic content to nude beaches. Because current laws in the US attempt to shield minors from overly sexual content, public nudity is generally illegal; it's easier to ban all of it rather than trying to determine context.

I like Canada's laws; women can legally go topless. It's nice to see equal treatment under the law.

Personally, I'm pretty comfortable being naked in public, depending on the context. At most of the ******* events I've been to (parties for people that like their tattoos, piercings, and more), I end up naked at some point. But it's not sexual. I'm fine at nude beaches. But I'd feel pretty uncomfortable shopping in the buff.

[Nyarlathotep]

Wow. I'm pretty amazed that that word was edited out. I didn't think that it was controversial. I should probably ask about that one.

[ForrestBlack]

Wow. I'm pretty amazed that that word was edited out. I didn't think that it was controversial. I should probably ask about that one.

It's not a specific controversial issue, so don't take it personal or anything. It's really just a matter of reciprocation. Communities that don't tend to allow their folks to talk about Blue Blood or don't allow Blue Blood to buy or trade ads or whatever are added to a list of terms that get starred out here in return. It's sort of a defense against the sorts of sites that love to spam their name and URL all over other people's sites, but don't allow other people's sites to be mentioned on theirs. If it's a closed door policy, then it's met with a closed door policy.

I should probably remove that specific one from the list anyway, since it kinda doesn't really apply anymore.

[ForrestBlack]

And yeah, as far as some of the points Mindgames was making, I really don't have any problem with people doing whatever they want to do, if they want to stop doing one sort of thing and get into doing another, that's cool. It's a matter of exploring what makes you happy. People shouldn't feel stuck or constrained by any given label or activity. Jax would look good doing fashion, hell, we've shot Jax fully clothed modeling latex designs for big European fetish fashion magazines. Realistically, some of the widest circulation fashion credits Jax has, we shot, so it would be pretty silly to object to Jax wanting to do more fun fashion stuff.

I do worry a little when people make declarations of I don't do this anymore because I only do that now, particularly when it comes with a certain value judgement attached. I don't really believe in a lot of the artificial barriers people put up between certain areas and/or activities. If you want to do something beautiful, fun, cool, etc. you really shouldn't let some sort of pigeon-hole evaluation of your past or whatever stop you from doing whatever you want.